Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth
01:21:40 · Lenny Rachitsky, Becky Kennedy
[01:21:40] S0: And what's it called for people to look it up on Amazon or wherever they want to buy the book? [01:21:40] S1: It's called Leave Me Alone!: A Good Inside Story About Deeply Feeling Kids. And if you have one, these kids, the reason the title I think will resonate and honestly, a lot of people say, "Ooh, that gives me a lot of insight in my partner, someone at work." Is around their fear of being too much, they tend to have big explosive feelings and push the people away they care about the most in the exact moments they actually need them, thereby confirming their fears. See, I really am too much, which exacerbates the cycle until they know how to change it. So leave me alone is something a deeply feeling kid will often scream in their room when they're completely out of control and that's actually in some ways their deepest fear, not their wish. And so the title plays to that. [01:22:20] S0: How cool. Okay. We'll definitely link to that in the show notes. [01:22:23] S1: Yes. [01:22:23] S0: You can look it up on your favorite bookseller. Dr. Becky, how fun was this? What a unique conversation. We touched topics on every level of humanity, I think. Before we get to our very exciting lightning round, is there anything else that you wanted to share? Anything else that you want to double down on?
01:22:43 · Becky Kennedy
[01:22:43] S1: Kind of I think before we started recording, I was saying how excited I am. I really mean it. You're like a major celebrity to me and my whole team knows it, that of all of the podcasts I've been on, they're like, "You must be nervous for Lenny." I was like, "I am." What I said to you is that I love your podcast because I just learn so much. Right. As a psychologist, CEO, obviously there's a lot for me to learn and I've learned so much from you and I really am addicted to learning. And the reason that's coming up for me now is I think about all the people who listen to your show who I think they're like that too. They're forever learners. They love to learn. It's why they love your podcast because you get so concrete and you follow the thread down the rabbit hole and it helps us feel more capable at work. And one of the things I've found interesting is so many people who have that forever learner growth mindset, whatever you want to call it at work, we forget to access it with our kids. We say things like, "It is the way it is." I feel like people who listen to your podcast probably don't say that at work. That's why they're listening to their podcast. Maybe it doesn't have to be the way it is. Or, "Oh, I didn't know that before, but now I do. So I can try something new." And again, I'm never going to be perfect. Perfect is creepy, but I can grow. I'm more addicted to growing and learning than being right. And I think, I guess I would just ask anyone listening, especially as a parent, to say, "What if I just took that mentality home?" Like, okay, yelled at my kid. I didn't mess them up forever. Do I know how to repair? By the way, did I have a parent who actually repaired with me? Because if I didn't, no wonder it feels awkward. I'm kind of the first person in my whole lineage to give a true apology to my three-year-old. Of course, that's going to feel hard. Or, yeah, I don't understand tantrums or I don't really understand why my good kid is lying to me, but maybe I could learn. I learn things at work all the time and I give myself credit. And what if I took that way of being and just applied it to this other area? I'd both, I think, be more compassionate with myself, but I probably also feel better over time about how I was showing up.
01:24:43 · Becky Kennedy, Lenny Rachitsky
And I just think we forget to apply that because again, parenting has been told as something that should just feel natural when it doesn't, right? So if we think of it as a set of skills, it's actually very hopeful. Oh, I learn skills from Lenny all the time. I can do that in parenting too. [01:24:59] S0: That's such a beautiful message. What I feel is anytime I watch one of your clips and then do that thing and then it works, it's like, oh, that expands your mind. Oh wow, there's so much more I could learn. I should go deeper on what the hell I'm doing. I don't know what I'm doing. So that is a really important message of like you can learn this skill. It's not something anyone just knows how to do. [01:25:19] S1: Yeah. And I like giving people very concrete things. So a question recently that I've asked my kids that have led to amazing moments just as a, is some version of, "If I could do one thing different this week to be a better parent to you, what would it be?" I guess it's kind of like a 360 degree- [01:25:37] S0: Yeah. That's [inaudible 01:25:38]. [01:25:38] S1: Review. Right. And- [01:25:39] S0: Give me a raise.
01:25:39 · Lenny Rachitsky, Becky Kennedy
[01:25:39] S0: Give me a raise. [01:25:40] S1: Sometimes your kid says the hurtful things. "You can not be on your phone as much," which just get ready for it and just get ready to receive. "Okay. Thank you for telling me that." And I think the thing that stops us is we think our kid is going to say "stupid things." "You could let me watch TV." The truth is no matter what your kid says, it's a window into their world. And again, you can be the pilot who listens but doesn't open the cockpit door. "Oh, what would it be like to watch all the TV you want? Oh, your friends watch more. I'm so glad you told me that. Oh, does that mean I can watch TV? Sweetie, that's not going to be one of the things I budge on, but maybe here's something we could do instead." But just asking your kid that question and not expecting a profound answer. It makes me think if anyone thought, "What if my manager asked me that question? Wouldn't I immediately just feel better about my manager anyway just from the asking of the question?" And I think it's just something so actionable that every time I do it with my kids, I notice their behavior's kind of better for the rest of the week just from that. And I want to give something high impact to anybody who's made it this far in the episode. [01:26:36] S0: I love that that's like the reverse of this approach to this episode is like from the work environment, what can you bring to your kids? And it's like, do a little 360, ask for what feedback can you give me in my performance review as a parent this week. [01:26:48] S1: Exactly.
01:26:48 · Becky Kennedy, Lenny Rachitsky
[01:26:48] S1: Exactly. [01:26:48] S0: So good. Okay. With that, Dr. Becky, we reached our very exciting lightning round. I've got five questions for you. Are you ready? [01:26:56] S1: Yes. [01:26:57] S0: Here we go. What are two or three books that you find yourself recommending most to other people? [01:27:03] S1: I love The Power of Moments. I love Messy Middle and I got a lot from Creativity, Inc as well. [01:27:11] S0: Is there a recent movie or TV show you have really enjoyed? [01:27:14] S1: I really liked Secrets We Keep, which was actually recommended to me by our product leader on Netflix. And I really loved K-Pop Demon Hunters so much. I wrote a whole guide on it because I think it's just such an opener for really good, deep connected moments with our kids. And so those two come to mind. [01:27:33] S0: Is there a product you recently discovered that you really like? Could be an app, could be clothing, could be a gadget. [01:27:39] S1: I started doing Liberty Puzzles. Do you know it? So some people- [01:27:39] S0: No.
01:27:39 · Lenny Rachitsky, Becky Kennedy
[01:27:39] S0: No. [01:27:42] S1: Have heard of Stave. They're like these, but this is Liberty. They're thick wooden puzzles where they're kind of hand cut pieces. You never know what's an edge. Sometimes the colors that connect are kind of the end of one color and start of another, so they're tricky. But having this out at night, number one, I find puzzling is something where you have to monotask. You truly cannot multitask. And I find it so hard for me to monotask these days, even though it gives me such grounded energy. So that allows that. And it's something, yes, with my kids, but oddly enough, me and my husband will find ourselves doing it together at night versus being on the couch, doing work. And I feel like we're in the same world working on something together. And it's been really fun for that as well. [01:28:25] S0: My kid has been really into puzzles recently. We have this menorah puzzle that we got and he's just every bedtime, he wants to do it four times, finishes it, again. He speaks Spanish because his grandma speaks Spanish to him, so he's like mas, una mas. [01:28:38] S1: Oh, I love it. Love puzzles. [01:28:40] S0: And I love that he's just like, "Break it apart. Okay, let's start from the beginning." [01:28:43] S1: Amazing. [01:28:44] S0: Yeah. Puzzles. How fun. Okay. Two more questions. Do you have a favorite life motto that you find useful in work or in life?