Venture Europe: Entrepreneurship | Technology | Venture Capital | Eu/Acc
00:07:24 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:07:24] S1: Yeah. We Reddit? [00:07:25] S0: Yeah. They were on, like, r slash London and... Or maybe r slash startupslondon or something. And we built a consumer app in 2013 that helped you find things to do in the city, which was this, like, social mobile local period that everyone was into back then. It was a bit of a smash hit. It went super parabolic, and we got millions of users, but we couldn't monetize it. So we basically started pivoting into like advertising and like working with brands to monetize what this consumer product that I'll spare the details, but like, we went through lots of iterations of that business and ended up with kind of like a pseudo software based agency where we connected large enterprise brands with content creators. And I worked on that until 2022. And I, yeah, I I left that business in 2022, had like a mini exit. I mean, that business was fucking hard. It sucked at times. Yeah. [00:08:31] S1: Why was it hard? [00:08:33] S0: It was just like pushing every day, pushing a heavy boulder up a steep hill. And I think like the the the biggest lesson that I took from that business is like, you know, the the market is everything. [00:08:53] S1: The market is everything.
00:08:53 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:08:53] S1: The market is everything. [00:08:55] S0: Like you can have the analogy I use. I I like I like analogies. The the the analogy that I've used is like the the team are the rowers. So you have a team of rowers, you know, rowers. Then the product is the boat that you're in. So you have a boat. And then the market is the river. Mhmm. And, like, you can have, like, a bunch of fat guys in a skiff on the rapids, and you're gonna go very far, very fast. [00:09:26] S1: Right. [00:09:26] S0: Or you can have, like, Olympian rowers in a polycarbonate, perfectly tuned boat The opposite. Going the opposite direction, and you're not gonna get very far. So I think, like, so much of... And, like, when when I had... When I stopped... You know, when when... Before I started ProFound, I spent so much time, I joined an accelerator called South Park Commons, and I was just obsessed with markets. I'd say tailwinds or markets are interchangeably. Because it's not just size of market. Don't just wanna pick a big market. You wanna pick like a... Markets are not, you know, they're they're they're not static. Mhmm. They move, and they got that... You know, market is either growing or dying, basically. Yep. And really, you wanna pick a market that's gonna grow really, really fast. And ideally, you time it well and try to be early, but there's a lot of black magic in that early stage because if you're a little bit... You know, if you're a year too early, you're toast. And if you're a year too late, you're toast. So you have to, like, time it very well.
00:10:24 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:10:24] S1: And you've tested so many business ideas. You've run so many businesses. You've tested so many business ideas. And to your point right now, you just got obsessed with markets. Because if the river goes against you, you're just going to push and push and push to no avail. Walk us through... If you'd be, like, twenty years, again, how would you go about to find a business idea and go and dedicate the next ten years to it? And the second question is, like, walk us through, like, how did you actually find the idea for ProFound at South Park Commons? [00:11:00] S0: Okay. So twenty... You said twenty years earlier? When I was 20 years old? [00:11:04] S1: When you were, like, 20 and just kinda testing all the, like, all the businesses across different sectors. [00:11:09] S0: I mean, I I... I'll upset you here. This is, this is not what you wanna hear. I'll give you a zinger. [00:11:14] S1: I have no agenda. [00:11:16] S0: Well, I know I'm I'm sat here at what was formerly known as Italian Tech Week with a lot of European... But I am allowed to say this because I'm British. Yeah. If I were telling the 20 year old me something, it'd probably be move to America. [00:11:29] S1: Move to America. I'm honest. You didn't move to America. No? Like, with ProFound?
00:11:29 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:11:29] S1: Move to America. I'm honest. You didn't move to America. No? Like, with ProFound? [00:11:32] S0: When I was like, yeah. Basically, with Kyra, the business I was telling you about, I was in America standing up a sales org. And then I met a girl, and we fell in love in November 2019. And then 2020 happened, and I was, oh, this will be a couple of weeks. I'll just stay at her place. Yeah. So I stayed at her place for about a year and a half, two years through COVID and ended up staying there. And we're married now, and, yeah, the rest is history. Yeah. I know questions. Thank you. Yeah. I know the the the... It's kind of brutal, the America thing, but, like, I don't know. It's like if you was, like... I won't say... You know, if there was someone standing in front of you and, like, you know, they had a really bad haircut, you're commenting. Like, the the the point I'm making is that the most obvious thing is move to America. Yeah. And it's... I I hate to say that, but America is a country that's that's built on immigrants. Yep. Risk takers. Like my my wife's grandfather's father was in the cohort of people that just, like, YOLO'd it and just came over to America. Yeah. And... Or grandfather's grandfather. And, yeah, that's in their blood. They're very they're very risk on. And I think if you're a red blooded capitalist and you're trying to start something, you want... It's not just it's not just capital. You want people who are, like, risk on.
00:11:32 · James Cadwallader, Calin Fabri
[00:11:32] S0: When I was like, yeah. Basically, with Kyra, the business I was telling you about, I was in America standing up a sales org. And then I met a girl, and we fell in love in November 2019. And then 2020 happened, and I was, oh, this will be a couple of weeks. I'll just stay at her place. Yeah. So I stayed at her place for about a year and a half, two years through COVID and ended up staying there. And we're married now, and, yeah, the rest is history. Yeah. I know questions. Thank you. Yeah. I know the the the... It's kind of brutal, the America thing, but, like, I don't know. It's like if you was, like... I won't say... You know, if there was someone standing in front of you and, like, you know, they had a really bad haircut, you're commenting. Like, the the the point I'm making is that the most obvious thing is move to America. Yeah. And it's... I I hate to say that, but America is a country that's that's built on immigrants. Yep. Risk takers. Like my my wife's grandfather's father was in the cohort of people that just, like, YOLO'd it and just came over to America. Yeah. And... Or grandfather's grandfather. And, yeah, that's in their blood. They're very they're very risk on. And I think if you're a red blooded capitalist and you're trying to start something, you want... It's not just it's not just capital. You want people who are, like, risk on. [00:13:05] S1: Yeah. I just... I was to the All In Summit in LA three weeks ago. Okay. So on stage, was, like, Jensen Huang, Satya Nadella, Elon Musk. [00:13:14] S0: All immigrants as well. Right?
00:13:14 · James Cadwallader, Calin Fabri
[00:13:14] S0: All immigrants as well. Right? [00:13:15] S1: Yes. And and... But I'm sorry. [00:13:17] S0: The conference immigrant? Did Jensen... Was Jensen born in Taiwan, or was he born in America? [00:13:21] S1: I don't know. I don't know. But but I think, like like, there are two things that I think America does very well that I see like a problem in Europe. Europe, like, has a legacy of aristocracy, so you need to prove yourself first. Whereas, like, in America, everyone kinda feels like an immigrant, and they actually appreciate underdogs. [00:13:41] S0: Yeah. [00:13:41] S1: Whereas, like, in Europe, where I'm more like, no. No. You need to prove yourself until you get, you know, like, your first real talk. Like, I was talking, like, with billionaires in America, like, easy. You know, it's easy to talk to them. Like, here, they just get, you know, very, very much protected. And then, like... So one is the the the easiness to talk with someone and how much they cheer on you. And then the second one would be just bureaucracy. Is... Are those the same friction points that you're seeing, or why do you think America is a better place to build in Europe? [00:14:12] S0: I mean, do you know the company, the startup, Klay? [00:14:15] S1: No. Oh, Klay. Yeah. Yeah.