Venture Europe: Entrepreneurship | Technology | Venture Capital | Eu/Acc
00:13:14 · James Cadwallader, Calin Fabri
[00:13:14] S0: All immigrants as well. Right? [00:13:15] S1: Yes. And and... But I'm sorry. [00:13:17] S0: The conference immigrant? Did Jensen... Was Jensen born in Taiwan, or was he born in America? [00:13:21] S1: I don't know. I don't know. But but I think, like like, there are two things that I think America does very well that I see like a problem in Europe. Europe, like, has a legacy of aristocracy, so you need to prove yourself first. Whereas, like, in America, everyone kinda feels like an immigrant, and they actually appreciate underdogs. [00:13:41] S0: Yeah. [00:13:41] S1: Whereas, like, in Europe, where I'm more like, no. No. You need to prove yourself until you get, you know, like, your first real talk. Like, I was talking, like, with billionaires in America, like, easy. You know, it's easy to talk to them. Like, here, they just get, you know, very, very much protected. And then, like... So one is the the the easiness to talk with someone and how much they cheer on you. And then the second one would be just bureaucracy. Is... Are those the same friction points that you're seeing, or why do you think America is a better place to build in Europe? [00:14:12] S0: I mean, do you know the company, the startup, Klay? [00:14:15] S1: No. Oh, Klay. Yeah. Yeah.
00:14:15 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:14:15] S1: No. Oh, Klay. Yeah. Yeah. [00:14:16] S0: Yeah. Yeah. So, Kareem, who's the CEO of Klay. Klay, for anyone who's not familiar, they're like a pretty successful New York based startup. And Kareem did a podcast quite recently that I was watching, probably on a Sunday, relaxing. And he... I thought we had a he had a really, really amazing take about entrepreneurship and risk that I've repeated a few times and really stuck with me. He said, it's only... You can only consider it risk if there's a healthy amount of shame if you fail. [00:14:50] S1: Right. [00:14:50] S0: And, like, you know, I think, like, you know, see, if if I if I, like, imploded this company now, you know, I've been on this... I'm sitting up here in front of these people on this podcast, and I'm gonna be on stage later. Like, the shame that it carries is, like, pretty severe. So I think... But I just think maybe the the difference between America and Europe is, like, they just have a different relationship with that shame. Like, I think the shame is carried so heavy in Europe. Yes. But, yeah, we don't have to over... I think, you know, like, you have Matty, Antoine. Like, you have some amazing founders in Europe coming out of Europe, and I think you don't... You can defy the odds. I mean, technically, we we we created this company in New New York City Yeah. Which is, you know, slightly less extreme than Europe, but, like, is probably suboptimal in comparison to San Francisco. Right. So we had to... You know, you can you can defy the odds here.
00:14:50 · James Cadwallader, Calin Fabri
[00:14:50] S0: And, like, you know, I think, like, you know, see, if if I if I, like, imploded this company now, you know, I've been on this... I'm sitting up here in front of these people on this podcast, and I'm gonna be on stage later. Like, the shame that it carries is, like, pretty severe. So I think... But I just think maybe the the difference between America and Europe is, like, they just have a different relationship with that shame. Like, I think the shame is carried so heavy in Europe. Yes. But, yeah, we don't have to over... I think, you know, like, you have Matty, Antoine. Like, you have some amazing founders in Europe coming out of Europe, and I think you don't... You can defy the odds. I mean, technically, we we we created this company in New New York City Yeah. Which is, you know, slightly less extreme than Europe, but, like, is probably suboptimal in comparison to San Francisco. Right. So we had to... You know, you can you can defy the odds here. [00:15:46] S1: So you're only saying that when you start a business, there are a couple of variables that you can keep in mind. And indeed, if you wanna optimize, let's say, for location, US is the best, but that doesn't mean that you will not succeed if you start in Europe.
00:15:46 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:15:46] S1: So you're only saying that when you start a business, there are a couple of variables that you can keep in mind. And indeed, if you wanna optimize, let's say, for location, US is the best, but that doesn't mean that you will not succeed if you start in Europe. [00:15:58] S0: Yeah. I think... Yeah. There's exceptions to every rule. But, like, if I were optimizing, I'd probably move to America. I'll give you another zinger, but, like, I think it's very... The... A debate that I've had with founder friends a lot. Like, me and my founder friends, I've had for years. We would debate, you know, do you need a tier one VC? Like, do you need a Sequoia, a Kleiner, a Thrive, a benchmark? Like, does it matter if these companies back you or, like Yeah. You know, is that... Is it like a causation or correlation? Right. I think it's probably a little bit of both, but I would say a US based company backed by a tier one investor or an s tier investor probably makes a very big difference to... Like, if you compare... Yes. Me and you start the same business. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I'm based in The USA. I'm backed by Sequoia. Yeah. You're you're based in London, and you're backed by a VC that no one's heard of. Yeah. I'd probably put the money on the former, [00:16:58] S1: if I'm honest. Absolutely. And also, like, there's a lot of talk about, king making right now. So, like, the top tier top tier VCs, they invest in a company, and, also, they have the capital to follow-up with. [00:17:09] S0: Yeah.
00:17:09 · James Cadwallader, Calin Fabri
[00:17:09] S0: Yeah. [00:17:09] S1: Meaning that... And the talent. Once you're kinda backed by a tier one, you can attract some of the best talent in the world because you're backed by a tier one. You have the capital to do whatever it takes to win. So, I mean, it's almost like at Olympics and maybe, you know, to your rowing example. Actually, my cousin is an Olympic medalist in rowing. But but I guess gold, silver, bronze Silver. [00:17:33] S0: Nice. Alright. [00:17:34] S1: Cool. In LA. But I guess, like like, to your point, you know, like, the investor maybe, like, in the in the boat and the team and the river, like, probably there is, you know, like, some waste that your investors actually bring because it's a flywheel then that gets created. [00:17:50] S0: Yeah. Think the flywheel is very real. Like, I mean, it's very hard to raise from these funds. Like, I started a business before ProFound. I won't go into it. It's like a stupid consumer thing. And I burned, like, a $250,000 of my own money on this thing just to try and get it off the ground. Yeah. And I went and met, like, every VC, and I just got destroyed, like, pummeled. It was, like, the biggest practice of humility in my career. Yep. And, yeah, licking my wounds off the back of that, I went and joined South Park Commons. Yep. And I was like, fuck, consumer. Yes. I'm not doing consumer anymore. That's too hard. [00:18:33] S1: All the founders of truckers, you were saying that.
00:18:33 · Calin Fabri, James Cadwallader
[00:18:33] S1: All the founders of truckers, you were saying that. [00:18:35] S0: Yeah. Like, trying to start a big business is like climbing Mount Everest. Yeah. And I start trying to do that with a consumer business. It's like, I'm gonna do Mount Everest with no oxygen masks in high heels. Right. [00:18:48] S1: And and let's talk a little bit about shame, and then we go to how... Like, the day you started ProFound. What would you recommend to founders, or what do you think was specifically different with you that you felt maybe less shame? Was it because you just started so many businesses, and you've tried and you fell, and you sold the sandwiches, and, you know, you traded gold and that you had, like, a less emotional attachment to the business, and you're just a little bit more practical. What would be your advice for someone that is 20 and they just kinda hear, like, oh, look. You know, in Europe, there's a huge association that if you fail, then you're not good enough, you're not worthy of love, or something like that. Whereas, like, if you're in in The US, actually, you get some pat on the back, like, done that you've prepped. [00:19:37] S0: I mean, I I I tried. Yeah. When I was at South Park Commons, which is the accelerator, it's like a very interesting environment because you're like, basically, you show up every day, and it's like a room kinda like this size, maybe twice the size of, like, this area. And it's just filled with... The the the the only prerequisite is that you have to be all in. So you can't be, like, holding down a job at the same time.