Life in Programmatic Digital Out-of-Home
00:08:59 · Dan Larden
[00:08:59] S2: I think from the brand side, it's very interesting now as well to understand where the budgets are coming from. And it's probably similar on your side, imagine being on the sell side or working with the suppliers directly, what their ambition is or why they're building these networks and these screens. Retail media has been classified as a new way that brands can take more control of just media in general. So the most advanced brands in this space are the Unilevers of the world and the P and Gs of the And I think they are on very specific programmes over the last three years to say, Let's forget about hiring an expert in channel, hire an expert in channel, hire an expert in channel, and then come up to a marketing director. They are now saying, maybe retail media is everything. And all actually we're talking about there is messaging the consumer. And so actually forget channel, forget data, forget where it's placed, forget how it's measured, forget how you define it, as we like to do all the time in our industry, is define a new channel and a new thing. It's actually just about consistent messaging. And those guys have been on a massive journey already to try and bring shopper, e com, trade, and media buyers all previously have never spoken to each other. They were all completely separate. Bringing those teams together under one budget, I think one of those things where is retail media driving in housing or this restructuring? Or is the in housing driving retail media? If you know what I mean, which one's driving which? Because I think it's just become almost like maybe digital should have done in the past. The opportunity just to sort of merge a whole lot of separate siloed things inside a brand and actually come up with, like, one single marketing consumer strategy?
00:11:14 · Jon Mundy, Dan Larden
[00:11:14] S1: Yeah. I think you're onto something there. I mean, I think that it's it's it's... One of the things that was always... I mean, it's not entirely surprising, but it's it's... It it... When you think about it, but it's always slightly shocked me is the lack of data that some FMCG brands have because they don't see the actual, you know, the data coming from retailers in the same way that the retailers have. So, you know, they have to then pay Dunhumby and Hector and others for that data. And fair enough, that's their business model. But they, you know, they are, you know, they're often, you know, their marketing strategy has been based on on on a relatively blind amount of data. This is fairly long term, whereas they they hit their retail team who are working directly with retailers. Retailers say, you know, this store does this. This store does this. They they know the story. And I think that that that's shifting now, and that's the story that's changing. And if you take I know I'm I'm gonna go back because I always talk about them because, you know, I like cheese. But Arla, who've who've who've [00:12:14] S2: Did the last podcast.
00:12:15 · Jon Mundy
[00:12:15] S1: Oh, yeah. We call them Arla a bit before. But I love Arla, you know, Crazy Danes with that with that with that with that milk and cheese. But no. What was really interesting about them is is, you know, they've built their in housing, their their their their media buying and then housing their their out of home and their in housing, anything programmatic and their creative. And they're actually starting to almost act as as as an agency for for other food brands as well. But what was really interesting was was the crossover between the data that they're taking in that themselves and actually starting to work more closely with with Excel data sources and being able to do it and and seeing them activate with a retail media focus rather than just an out of home focus. And it's... You know, and and and that's... I mean, they're they're they're a small example, but there are better examples in in the likes of Unilever and P and G who are doing that. And it's it's a significant shift away from the old buying model. And it's essentially those two those two verticals of of the marketing team and the retail team becoming one. And then obviously, you've also got the retail team of the the the the supermarkets who, you know, are also big advertisers, but they're also massive media owners, and they're becoming one and they're beginning to act as as agencies on behalf of their clients. So P and G will be spending money with Tesco for reinstall retail media, but Tesco could equally put that into a Tesco campaign that goes on out of home and beyond for that particular brand. We do some work with John Lewis, for example, when John Lewis John Lewis do exactly that. So John Lewis buy media from us, but they do it on behalf of their behalf of their brands. They might be running a campaign for Samsung and John Lewis. Yes. And I think that's a really interesting evolution of retailers acting almost as agencies on behalf of the products they sell.
00:14:04 · Dan Larden, Jon Mundy
[00:14:04] S2: So question actually then, so when you're because we're seeing this as well. So when we speak to the likes of Nectar or Dunhumby, they say that an awful lot of their conversations are direct to the brands and a lot of their buyers are speaking to them directly and buying directly. When you see out of home under the retail media spectrum, are you seeing that coming more directly from the brands themselves than through the agencies? Because I think within this conversation, it's really interesting to understand the role of the agency here in the retail media space. [00:14:38] S1: My experience is that it's still very much agency focused. We work more closely with the agencies, the specialists still, you know, hold court and all that sort of thing. But there is a change happening, and I think Programmatic is is part of that change. You know, it's with... It's changing people's perception of of out of home as part of that. And when it becomes available to the teams that wouldn't traditionally have bought it, then you'll start seeing more revenue coming from brand direct because they'll find out that, you know, they're buying through Trade Desk or whatever for their in house team. They'll be like, Oh, we can buy we can buy the bus stop outside. Can we? We could tie that into the campaign we're doing at Tesco. Oh, okay. So there you go. And then it becomes, you know, and I think that that shift is something that is starting to happen and will only accelerate.
00:15:31 · Dan Larden
[00:15:31] S2: Yeah. That's where it's very interesting for our industry in general. And probably for the majority of people that will listen to this podcast, right? There'll be media people. Yeah. But actually, when I speak to a head of shopper at a big effort team, they're so used to going directly to all of their supermarkets. They've got global deals with all of the big, the Walmarts and the Tesco's, etcetera. They've been buying cardboard since the 70s to sort of do a price promotion thing. So they are coming into our world within this because they're saying, I don't really understand the media world, and there's quite a lot of different pieces of the media world which are coming in, I. E. Infrastructure, measurements, attribution, all that sort of stuff, which we're really okay with. But equally, you've got this idea of the media guys who suddenly have no idea about price and promotion and cardboard and real estate, really. So I think that role of the agency piece is going be very interesting because if the shopper trade and ecom and these guys who previously have not really ever known the media side suddenly control, it's going be really interesting.
00:16:44 · Jon Mundy
[00:16:44] S1: Yeah, that agency is suddenly waking up to the fact that they have to start talking to retailers as media owners, as sources and as data partners is fascinating. Actually, it's already happening. If you look at the stuff that Publicis has done with Carrefour in France and that sort of evolution, is an absolute shift. Every major agency group has got a head of retail and a severe focus on retail and a strong focus on retail media. And it's not just a you know, it's not the same old same old sort of media buying thing. It is very much a focus on the sort of the shopper marketing story. And I think we do get consumed by online retail as a story, and it's been the thing. But actually, it's that point that the biggest opportunity is in bricks and mortar. It always has been and always will be. It's not going to go away. I remember ten years ago, everyone was talking about, oh, the death of the high street. And the high street's changed, but people still like to buy things in person.