Sub Club by RevenueCat
00:33:39 · Jacob Eiting, Jack McDermott, David Barnard
[00:33:39] S3: fit together. Right? You need people who are, like, take responsibility too. Right? [00:33:42] S1: The advice is, like, not to go out and and just find a bunch of former founders and bring them into a very Total... Hierarchical culture. Like, that's that's not going to work. You're gonna have a lot of clashes and they're gonna leave. And there there's gonna be lots of ideas that that compete. But when you create systems that fit together, right, small teams with driven product minded engineers and founders that fit with, like, this go fast and ship move, then I think that's where you really start to get harmony, and and you can kinda deliver bigger results. [00:34:15] S0: One of the challenges with with moving fast and then and then even, you know, as much as I praised it, like, building toward the Twitter thread or the viral TikTok is that you can sometimes end up building kinda flash in the pan, gimmicky things. How do you think about balancing that kind of moving fast and creating those big launches, but then also kind of building toward this more retentive use cases, a product that is gonna be used for years and meaningful for years versus just kinda moving quick and slapping out a bunch of features that don't end up getting used?
00:34:15 · David Barnard, Jack McDermott
[00:34:15] S0: One of the challenges with with moving fast and then and then even, you know, as much as I praised it, like, building toward the Twitter thread or the viral TikTok is that you can sometimes end up building kinda flash in the pan, gimmicky things. How do you think about balancing that kind of moving fast and creating those big launches, but then also kind of building toward this more retentive use cases, a product that is gonna be used for years and meaningful for years versus just kinda moving quick and slapping out a bunch of features that don't end up getting used? [00:34:46] S1: It's a really good question. It's one that I can already reflect on, you know, over the last year and a half. A couple of the features or or growth campaigns that that we built and launched that might might in hindsight look like a flash in the pan. One thing that our CEO and and co founder, Mati, told me a couple weeks ago, he he encouraged a quote from Brian Armstrong on Coinbase, where action gets information. And so I think at the end of the day, like, if you're willing to take action, you're gonna ultimately get more... You know, you're gonna have more information about your market, about your users, about your pricing model than than just not pursuing So I do think that, like, the the way to think about it, right, is that in hindsight, it might be a flash in the pan. But in forward sight, it might actually help guide your future decisions. So I think that that's been one thing that I felt to be be true here.
00:34:46 · Jack McDermott, Tanmay Jain
[00:34:46] S1: It's a really good question. It's one that I can already reflect on, you know, over the last year and a half. A couple of the features or or growth campaigns that that we built and launched that might might in hindsight look like a flash in the pan. One thing that our CEO and and co founder, Mati, told me a couple weeks ago, he he encouraged a quote from Brian Armstrong on Coinbase, where action gets information. And so I think at the end of the day, like, if you're willing to take action, you're gonna ultimately get more... You know, you're gonna have more information about your market, about your users, about your pricing model than than just not pursuing So I do think that, like, the the way to think about it, right, is that in hindsight, it might be a flash in the pan. But in forward sight, it might actually help guide your future decisions. So I think that that's been one thing that I felt to be be true here. [00:35:38] S2: When we think about these launches, it's not we're launching for launching sake. It's actually about what is the most impactful thing that we can build that is going to provide a better user experience? How can we build it as furiously as quickly as possible and then express the value of it in the best possible way? Right? Like, we we deeply think about what are the next things we launch. We... Sure, some of them might hit, some of them might fail, but we're always coming from the lens of, like, how does this improve the user experience? Not, wouldn't it be cool if we shipped this thing?
00:35:38 · Tanmay Jain, Jack McDermott
[00:35:38] S2: When we think about these launches, it's not we're launching for launching sake. It's actually about what is the most impactful thing that we can build that is going to provide a better user experience? How can we build it as furiously as quickly as possible and then express the value of it in the best possible way? Right? Like, we we deeply think about what are the next things we launch. We... Sure, some of them might hit, some of them might fail, but we're always coming from the lens of, like, how does this improve the user experience? Not, wouldn't it be cool if we shipped this thing? [00:36:10] S1: And I tend to find... You know, I I think you brought this up, Jacob. Like, I tend to find the, like, x for y to lead you down the wrong path. Like, when I think of the times where where we've developed or built or or or grown tools that haven't worked, it tends to be applying ideas or concepts from somewhere else and being like, wouldn't it be cool if... Or, you know, did you see that? Could we do that? Right? And that direct one for one application versus starting with, you know, what's our unique take or what's our unique story on this or what are the capabilities that we have at ElevenLabs that no one else has. And I think when you get back to that space, you start to unlock a lot more creative ideas that that ultimately, you know, move beyond the flash in the pan stage and actually allow you to build, you know, compound growth over time.
00:36:10 · Jack McDermott, David Barnard
[00:36:10] S1: And I tend to find... You know, I I think you brought this up, Jacob. Like, I tend to find the, like, x for y to lead you down the wrong path. Like, when I think of the times where where we've developed or built or or or grown tools that haven't worked, it tends to be applying ideas or concepts from somewhere else and being like, wouldn't it be cool if... Or, you know, did you see that? Could we do that? Right? And that direct one for one application versus starting with, you know, what's our unique take or what's our unique story on this or what are the capabilities that we have at ElevenLabs that no one else has. And I think when you get back to that space, you start to unlock a lot more creative ideas that that ultimately, you know, move beyond the flash in the pan stage and actually allow you to build, you know, compound growth over time. [00:37:04] S0: Yeah. On on that note, Tanmay, you had a really great post on LinkedIn about, like, don't just build another Spotify Wrapped. I mean, it's a perfect example of what Jack was saying about how, like, you know, everybody thinks, well, how can I build this Spotify Wrapped of my product? But but your post was great about, like, that's not a great way to think. Tell me more about that.
00:37:04 · David Barnard, Tanmay Jain, Jacob Eiting
[00:37:04] S0: Yeah. On on that note, Tanmay, you had a really great post on LinkedIn about, like, don't just build another Spotify Wrapped. I mean, it's a perfect example of what Jack was saying about how, like, you know, everybody thinks, well, how can I build this Spotify Wrapped of my product? But but your post was great about, like, that's not a great way to think. Tell me more about that. [00:37:23] S2: Yeah. I saw this pattern. I feel like it becomes truer and truer every year. I thought, like, every year people learn, but it only becomes truer and truer. Is that, every year Spotify Wrapped will drop like clockwork, and it's amazing. And a random product out there, you know, not to name names, will do their version of a Wrapped. [00:37:39] S3: Mine mine this year is Phil's Coffee. I got a Phil's Coffee wrapped in the mail this year, which that's how I knew it had jumped the shark. [00:37:48] S2: Yeah. Yeah. That's how you know when Wrapped has gone beyond mainstream. And post post cool is probably the... [00:37:55] S3: I love Phil's Coffee. Don't get me wrong, but maybe we didn't need a Wrapped. It's fine. Yeah.