00:21:57 · Eric Jorgenson
[00:21:57] S1: Yeah. More than worried. That's it. Like, there's stories of him being, like, blowing up, basically, when he, I think he went to Starbase or something, and there was, like, five people working at the Rocket, and he went off. He was like, it is fucked up that there's only five people here. I've got, you know, 300 people on payroll. This place should look like a beehive, I think, twenty four seven is, like, actually his... Like, the way he talked about it, at least in that moment. And he's like, I'm setting up a camera, and I'm gonna... I want it to look like a time lapse beehive all the time. And, you know, reasonable people can say like, well, you're just like, that's an asshole thing to do. What matters is X, Y, Z. Like, you're... You could be more elegant and, you know, why do you need people to be working at 2AM? And I think that that sort of misses the point that, like, the cultures that Elon builds are high intensity, maximum effort at all times cultures. And the surges at many times have saved the company, like the Tesla Model three production surge or, you know, the the Starship surge, but there's also ones where he's, like, not... You know, in in the Isaacson book in particular, Isaacson seems to hard judge harshly some of the surges that he called, which is like there's no point in stacking the starship, on the booster at that particular time. And I think Elon would say, yes, but it's a very powerful demonstration to have this thing that looks like a skyscraper and have people be able to take photos of it and have it closer to ready because it manifests and catalyzes us to to get that work done. And so, you know, I kinda say I I would trust Isaacson less than Musk to decide which surges are gonna do the best for his company.
00:23:32 · Ty Morse
[00:23:32] S0: It's kind of funny when you have some, like, third party that hasn't ever built anything like that come in and be like, here's what I think makes sense. And it's like, but you have no track record to prove that it... Like, your thing works. So you're just talking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:23:46 · Eric Jorgenson
[00:23:46] S1: And it's a and it's a reasonable reasonable people criticize Elon for being unreasonable. And I think one of Elon's superpowers is being unreasonable. I mean, the the, quote, all progress depends on the unreasonable man. Like, the cultures that he builds by driving these surges and by insisting on this intensity and by ensuring that people are working at max effort all the time. It selects for the people who want to be in that kind of environment, and it's what drives... You know, it's very hard to just switch gears from like, oh, I normally drive, you know, the speed limit all the time, and I never push my car, but all of a sudden, I'm Max Verstappen, and I'm gonna be, you know, able to drive a Formula one course at top speed. No. Like, the people who are pushing the limit constantly are the ones who are able to push the limit most effectively. And so I think that's the cultural value that he tries to instill is maniacal urgency at all times, maximum effort, and you never know kind of which things are gonna break through and matter in retrospect. If you attack a bottleneck before it becomes a bottleneck, then you have saved time. If it was invisible, you might not necessarily know. But if you're pushing that urgency all the time, you're preventing future bottlenecks from arising that, again, is gonna accelerate the timeline and draw up the progress that the overall business is creating.
00:25:01 · Ty Morse, Eric Jorgenson
[00:25:01] S0: When we were talking about basically, like, this different evolution of Elon from, like, 1996 to later, at some point around 2012, 2013, he stops complaining about being CEO, and he just learns that, you know, that is a thing that he has to do. And then there's also this funny thing recently where he'll be, you know, live streaming, playing video games for seven hours or something and people, you know, six days a week, people are like, how the fuck is he doing this and also running these six different companies? Like, they're seeing the Rockets go up and he's just playing, you know, Diablo. It's very confusing. And the the conclusion that I've come to is that he's effectively done something similar to MrBeast. MrBeast would have someone shadow him for a year, try to clone him, basically impress the way of his thinking, the way he makes decisions, all this stuff into this other person. And then he could just have them go and basically be like a mini MrBeast clone. And I think Elon's kind of done the same thing where he's effectively got, like, 20, maybe 25 people, across his organizations that all think and act in the Elon way. [00:25:59] S1: Yeah. [00:25:59] S0: And then he can just have them execute his will autonomously without having to be there all the time. [00:26:04] S1: Yeah. I learned that actually in... Specifically from your interview with Sean Maguire, which is awesome. And he goes right into that off the top talking about how, like, we give Elon, the guy, a lot of credit for the things that are actually dozens of people or in some cases, like
00:26:04 · Eric Jorgenson, Ty Morse
[00:26:04] S1: Yeah. I learned that actually in... Specifically from your interview with Sean Maguire, which is awesome. And he goes right into that off the top talking about how, like, we give Elon, the guy, a lot of credit for the things that are actually dozens of people or in some cases, like [00:26:21] S0: Elon's basically an octopus. Of people?
00:26:22 · Eric Jorgenson
[00:26:22] S1: Yeah. And he's, you know, he's just... In many ways, he's a symbol, now. He's he's almost like a Batman for, you know, founders and entrepreneurs that we are ascribing things to him that are almost superhuman in ways that are, like, there's productive ways to do that and unproductive ways to do it. But I think the the cloning... Mister... The way mister Beast talks about cloning is is so perfect and actually should be the gold standard for onboarding, and it's so funny that for all the books and professionals in onboarding and whatever, nobody has done the, like, simple street smart, obviously best thing that he... That mister Bees does, which is just, like, once you're hired, you're smart enough to be in this role. You're just gonna sit next to me for twenty four hours a day. Move in with me. Follow me around. Shadow me, and I... I'm going to download my brain into you, and you're gonna absorb as much as you possibly can. And so you can think like me. You could talk like me. You can... You should absorb all of my mental models and execute, as you said, execute my will autonomously in exactly the same way as I would if I were there. And Elon's been at that a way longer time than than Jimmy. Right? He's twenty years into building these teams and collecting some of the best engineers in the world and collaborating with them to figure out, like, the algorithm as a a program, the maniacal urgency, the first principles thinking, like... And there are so many stories of people that are really, really high quality Elon clones who are steeped in these things, who... Like, Martin Cozza, like tackling Starlink. Right? Starlink was, you know, 10 x too expensive and 10 x under production limits, and so they fired the entire Starlink team. Martin Cozza flew up there with a group of his people. They war roomed. They first principled. They they algorithmed, and they had covered two orders of magnitude gap in like, I think it was like ten to twelve months or something like that. This program that had been stalled for years under the expertise of actual satellite engineers who'd been working in this industry their whole lives from a bunch of rocky guys who knew Elon's sort of methods and mindset but had never worked in this particular industry before. And I...