Latent Space: The AI Engineer Podcast
00:37:01 · Shawn Wang, Jacob Lauritzen
[00:37:01] S1: Do you find, like, you must export to Excel or, like, people are happy to live in your spreadsheet? People are [00:37:05] S0: happy to live there. [00:37:06] S1: Do you use AG Grid or your own We do use AG Grid. AG Grid? That seems to be like the leading one. I mean, they've done this for like, I don't know, fifteen years. [00:37:13] S0: Yeah. They know how to... [00:37:14] S1: Yeah. So so... Okay. Yeah. I mean, I'm happy on that that spreadsheet angle. I mean, I think the the only other interesting thing for me engineering wise is the fan outs. Yep. Engineers maybe can... Are well equipped to understand the trade offs of like, well, okay, before you fan this thing out on a million documents, maybe test it on like two. Yep. Yeah. [00:37:34] S0: Does that work before you go nuts? [00:37:35] S1: Yep. Do they do that? [00:37:36] S0: They will. So, types of review actually will run the first 10 rows. Yeah. Just check. Right? Yeah. Does this make sense? Did it did it show us what we thought it was gonna show us? Yeah. That's a that's really good. Oh, but also for people, when people build this, it's just really good for them to iterate quickly on the first 10 rows until, like, they have they're getting the results that they want, and then they can go ham. [00:37:53] S1: Yeah. I am happy to move on to the next thing, intake, which is your Slackbot. Yep. Yep. Everyone has a Slackbot.
00:37:53 · Shawn Wang, Jacob Lauritzen
[00:37:53] S1: Yeah. I am happy to move on to the next thing, intake, which is your Slackbot. Yep. Yep. Everyone has a Slackbot. [00:37:59] S0: What's different So about ours is just legal specific, and what what happens with ours is it's not actually... It might also... We'll also build one that's just an interface to the agent, but it's actually specifically to basically kick off an agent that then adds a task to our list. So we have this list thing, which is like linear, for, you know, that's the closest equivalent, and so it will add it to a specific intake list, and then lawyers and agents can go into Legora and just be like, okay, these are the things that, you know, people are sending to us as our law firm or as our legal team in a big corporate. We can kick off agents for them, we can collaborate on them, and then we can just like mark them as done, and then it gets sent back in Slack. So it's more of a... It's not just like kicking off an agent, it's more of a like, I don't know, storefront thing, where it's like, hey, here's the ticket, want this thing reviewed. Okay. Now not... Here it is. It's back. No one needs to change anything, the legal team just sits in Legora and, like, manages the agents and everything there. I think
00:37:59 · Jacob Lauritzen, Shawn Wang
[00:37:59] S0: What's different So about ours is just legal specific, and what what happens with ours is it's not actually... It might also... We'll also build one that's just an interface to the agent, but it's actually specifically to basically kick off an agent that then adds a task to our list. So we have this list thing, which is like linear, for, you know, that's the closest equivalent, and so it will add it to a specific intake list, and then lawyers and agents can go into Legora and just be like, okay, these are the things that, you know, people are sending to us as our law firm or as our legal team in a big corporate. We can kick off agents for them, we can collaborate on them, and then we can just like mark them as done, and then it gets sent back in Slack. So it's more of a... It's not just like kicking off an agent, it's more of a like, I don't know, storefront thing, where it's like, hey, here's the ticket, want this thing reviewed. Okay. Now not... Here it is. It's back. No one needs to change anything, the legal team just sits in Legora and, like, manages the agents and everything there. I think [00:38:52] S1: the the data structure for this kind of thing is really interesting because it's, like, basically the inbox, right, for all these kinds of queries that can potentially translate into a thing, into something else, into And, something like, I I don't know. Is it hard to integrate all these with all the other features, or do you just not worry about it?
00:38:52 · Shawn Wang, Jacob Lauritzen
[00:38:52] S1: the the data structure for this kind of thing is really interesting because it's, like, basically the inbox, right, for all these kinds of queries that can potentially translate into a thing, into something else, into And, something like, I I don't know. Is it hard to integrate all these with all the other features, or do you just not worry about it? [00:39:11] S0: It's... No. It's not. I think we have some primitives that work really well. So, like, lists is a great primitive, because it's essentially, it's extremely flexible. Also like Notion database. [00:39:21] S1: Yeah, a Notion database. [00:39:22] S0: It's like a Notion database, and so you can basically configure it for whatever you want, and we, of course, invest a lot into making this super scalable and work really well, and you can have triggers on them, automations on them, and it's like a great glue to glue everything together, because then you can kick off an agent run based on a list if something happens, and then that comes back and populates a field or whatever, adds new documents or whatever it is, and so it's just like you might coordinate a bunch of coding agents with linear or some sort of task management tool, we can do it similarly with lists. And so, like, agents can create lists, and lists can create agents, and Wow. Agents can read lists, and so it's like, the agent swarm comes alive.
00:39:22 · Jacob Lauritzen, Shawn Wang
[00:39:22] S0: It's like a Notion database, and so you can basically configure it for whatever you want, and we, of course, invest a lot into making this super scalable and work really well, and you can have triggers on them, automations on them, and it's like a great glue to glue everything together, because then you can kick off an agent run based on a list if something happens, and then that comes back and populates a field or whatever, adds new documents or whatever it is, and so it's just like you might coordinate a bunch of coding agents with linear or some sort of task management tool, we can do it similarly with lists. And so, like, agents can create lists, and lists can create agents, and Wow. Agents can read lists, and so it's like, the agent swarm comes alive. [00:39:54] S1: Yeah. Do people get excited or overwhelmed by that? You know, like, I I feel like this is basically end user programming. You're... You know, you can let people set up crazy automations. Some people get super obsessed by it, and they become, like, influence... Like, it'd be cool to have like Yeah. Right. Has influencers. Yeah. Is that worth it? Too overcomplicated?
00:40:14 · Jacob Lauritzen
[00:40:14] S0: We need the flexibility, even if we don't actually expose it to the end user. Let's say this was just all internal, then it's a really fast way for us to utilize people like our legal engineers to basically build a lot of products extremely fast. So, like, you can build custom, like, fund management dashboards. You can basically build that on List with, like, your own generative UI, and then you basically have a new product that some people are gonna love, and we can have a marketplace of just a bunch of specialized products that we can scale super quickly, because all of our legal engineers can just build new ones. If they're out with a client, oh, you want your own? Easy. We'll just fix one for you, so it's like a lovable inside Legora a little bit, and if we don't wanna expose it, that's also how we build our own custom feature. So we we made another acquisition in The UK called Wexler, and they're doing fact intelligence, which is for litigation mostly, which is like you upload a million documents for a lawsuit or whatever, and then we extract facts from those with named entities and dates and whatever, and then when you have all the facts, you can basically hold them up against each other and see which ones are corroborated and which ones are, what do call, disagreement. They... You know? And that's extremely powerful, because then you can also transcribe a court hearing, and you can like, oh, he said this thing, but actually, the email over here says that he was not there. And it's like, if you see it live, it's like so fucking cool. Yeah. And that we can also build on this primitive. And so, like, we can build a lot of really cool things on this one primitive, basically. That's how we think about it. It's like we have to be... As we scale the company, we just have to solve so many things, and like, so I think a lot about how do we build a core primitive that we can scale to many different end products and create very customizable experiences.