00:27:38 · Henrique Dubugras, Nik Storonsky
[00:27:38] S1: Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Well, usually intuition, you know, have to build it from You're very kind of like numbers focused and you always talk about like the growth and, you know, it's a really interesting like way to think when you're that young, you know? [00:27:54] S0: Yeah. [00:27:55] S1: Yeah. Okay. So then Revolut... Okay. So tell me what the first, first idea for Revolut was.
00:27:55 · Henrique Dubugras, Nik Storonsky
[00:27:55] S1: Yeah. Okay. So then Revolut... Okay. So tell me what the first, first idea for Revolut was. [00:28:00] S0: So I simply wanted to have a cut. So basically what I've done, I set up myself multiple bank accounts with different currencies. And when I was traveling and sending money, I was trying to spend from these bank accounts and some money from these bank accounts. But it was like super clunky, like very difficult. And then back then online banking was also pretty shit. So you cannot really, you know, go on the website. Need to put, you know, tons of passwords, some devices. It was like really messy back then. So I decided to effectively build a company or a product, like a bank account plus account attached to it. So you can go abroad and then spend in multiple currencies at intermankrate. So kind of in my head, I already knew how to do infrastructure around it in terms of hedging currency exchange because obviously I was a trader. I don't know how things work. But then in terms of cut payment infrastructure, I knew zero. So what I've done, I started researching how to get it done. I found, call it, partners in the value chain, like an issuing bank, processor, card factory, a few others to put it all together, to integrate it all. And I launched a card. Then I was trying to find how to issue a multicurrency card, how to stop infrastructure. And everyone told me from issuing banks that, you know, it's not possible. It doesn't exist. So what I've done, hired the best consultant, prepaid card consultant in The UK to help me with the infrastructure.
00:28:00 · Nik Storonsky, Henrique Dubugras
[00:28:00] S0: So I simply wanted to have a cut. So basically what I've done, I set up myself multiple bank accounts with different currencies. And when I was traveling and sending money, I was trying to spend from these bank accounts and some money from these bank accounts. But it was like super clunky, like very difficult. And then back then online banking was also pretty shit. So you cannot really, you know, go on the website. Need to put, you know, tons of passwords, some devices. It was like really messy back then. So I decided to effectively build a company or a product, like a bank account plus account attached to it. So you can go abroad and then spend in multiple currencies at intermankrate. So kind of in my head, I already knew how to do infrastructure around it in terms of hedging currency exchange because obviously I was a trader. I don't know how things work. But then in terms of cut payment infrastructure, I knew zero. So what I've done, I started researching how to get it done. I found, call it, partners in the value chain, like an issuing bank, processor, card factory, a few others to put it all together, to integrate it all. And I launched a card. Then I was trying to find how to issue a multicurrency card, how to stop infrastructure. And everyone told me from issuing banks that, you know, it's not possible. It doesn't exist. So what I've done, hired the best consultant, prepaid card consultant in The UK to help me with the infrastructure. [00:29:37] S1: How did you find that guy?
00:29:37 · Henrique Dubugras, Nik Storonsky
[00:29:37] S1: How did you find that guy? [00:29:38] S0: Someone recommended me to him. And I called him and he said, no. Like, it's impossible to get done. I won't even charge you charge you for it. I said, okay, why don't you wait? Why don't I pay you, like, you know, for two days consulting? Just come to the office. You explain me how Mastercard works, Visa works, card processing works, and maybe we'll figure something out. So I sat down with the team and then... [00:30:01] S1: Why do you think it was impossible? [00:30:03] S0: Like why? Which is because no one ever done it before in The UK. And so we kind of sat down with the team and then we figure out how to get it done. We showed the scheme to him and he says, yeah, it might be possible. So that's. [00:30:15] S1: What was the first version of it? Like, how did you get it done early on? [00:30:19] S0: So basically all the... I think all the prepaid card providers, they were putting balances on the card. Right? So it was sitting with a processor. But as soon as you take it out, right, you create a ledger yourself. And then you just simply authorize based on the signals, then it is definitely possible. [00:30:35] S1: Got it. So what you do is like you basically, instead of using the balances from the prepaid card providers, you would like just use them as an authorization engine and then have the balances yourself and In [00:30:47] S0: the ledger.
00:30:47 · Nik Storonsky, Henrique Dubugras
[00:30:47] S0: the ledger. [00:30:47] S1: In the ledger. Yeah. You know, it's funny. It's not too dissimilar when we started Brex because everyone told us that doing a credit card was very hard in The US because, you know, banks and credit. So what we did is we we got a prepaid card and then we just prefund it, but have a ledger on credit on the back. And they would just like, you know, charge people and then like keep funding it, you know, for the for the amount of Fucking system. Yeah. Exactly. It was like similar, I guess, with what you guys did. So so the value proposition for the customer was I am traveling around and I don't wanna pay FX. Yeah. And, you know, I can just like spend in different countries for free. [00:31:24] S0: Yeah. I also wanted to to do transfers as well. So I wanted to to have an account with a card which would also allow me to send money abroad. Because I mean, it's just convenient. And then everyone was telling me, no, it's crazy. It's like, you know, two different products. Why would you put two different products in kind of, you know, one app? Like every single person told me, VCs told me, like founders in fintech told me. But I I just kept insisting. So I build the account with a button, transfer money abroad. And then with the card as well to spend from the same balance. [00:31:52] S1: Got it. So you would be... You're able to put like some balance there so you can like transfer that to the card as well? And that was impossible.
00:31:52 · Henrique Dubugras, Nik Storonsky
[00:31:52] S1: Got it. So you would be... You're able to put like some balance there so you can like transfer that to the card as well? And that was impossible. [00:31:58] S0: Well, a card was attached to the wallet. Right? So a card was simply authorization method. But then from this wallet, from this balance, you could also send money in different currencies to a different [00:32:08] S1: Well, that was probably hard to build too. Right? [00:32:10] S0: Was hard to build too. [00:32:11] S1: And like where did you get the insight of that people would want that? Like how did you build that intuition? [00:32:17] S0: Just because I want it in myself. And for me it was obvious if I save money that way plus it's slick to use, why wouldn't other people use it as well? [00:32:26] S1: So you're like, I travel and when I travel, I hate paying FX fees. [00:32:30] S0: Exactly. Yeah. [00:32:31] S1: And you know, if it's easy, why wouldn't? And were you doing some version of it yourself? Would you have multiple cards that you were kind of using yourself? [00:32:38] S0: Yeah. Before this product, I had multiple cards, multiple accounts. I was, know, transferring money from one account to another to the broker as well to exchange money. So... [00:32:45] S1: Gotcha. And like, I guess, have you always liked being optimum... Optimizing costs like that in your life?