00:35:52 · Luca Ferrari
[00:35:52] S1: it's all virtual, Ivan. It's all a lot of stuff. So so anyway, we we wanted to to build that that that startup, but we had no money. And it wasn't... At least we thought it wouldn't wouldn't be easy to raise seed capital either. And maybe it's easier or it was was easier and certainly easier in The States. It wasn't for us. So we figured, how do we do this? And so the three of us, very good friends in the time and even more so today because we've gone through so much over the following fifteen plus years, We we figured, okay, we all all of us look for a job, and whoever gets the most lucrative offer accepts it and pays for rent and food for the other two. The other two would work on a prototype and basically the startup until we can convince someone to give us some money, so whoever is working can quit and we can all focus on the startup. We all look for a job and... Well, frankly, one of us was doing a PhD already, so that was our backup plan, but not a super lucrative job, so that, you know, we were hoping to do better than that. And I happened to get an offer from McKinsey for a consulting job, a strategic consultant. And so that was the best offer we got. And I remember I was terrified because I I mean, I'm close to incapable of lying or being opaque. I I always want to be honest and transparent, but that's why I decided I would tell the partner from McKinsey who extended an offer to me that, yes, I was going to work there if they wanted me, give it my 100%, but the plan was as soon as possible for me to quit, to go to the start. And I was so convinced that they would withdraw the offer, you know, because we want to hire someone who was kind of as a... Who's who's not wanting to for
00:37:38 · David Senra
[00:37:38] S0: a little bit. I'm trying to leave as fast as possible.
00:37:40 · Luca Ferrari
[00:37:40] S1: Exactly. Incredibly, that partner was enthusiastic about the project and said, yeah, it's great. We want to have you here. So very grateful, very inspired, worked very hard, as hard as I could. I was working on the on the startup in the, you know, basically during the night. But not like when people say during the night, I mean, 7PM to 9PM. I mean, like, from midnight to in the morning, And then on the weekends, and and then I remember after the one year at McKinsey, had my, I don't know, three weeks of vacation or something like that. I I spent to work, like, full time on the start. Anyway, about a year later, we managed to to raise about $500,000. And so I quit. I mean, I finished a project another two, three months, and then I I I left. So, yes, that's my stint in consulting. And I and I think I saw something there that I I think has some similarities to Banish most of the time. Most of the people who applied to work at McKinsey, and I'm pretty sure it was the same for BCG, Bing, these other consultancies, were very excited to be working there. They got some of the best graduates, at least from business, maybe not as much from engineering. But then you would end up serving telcos, banks, insurance companies to which you would never have sent your CV. And I think Bending Spoons is kind of similar for software engineers, product designers, product managers. I believe we got some exceptionally good talent, especially students, graduates, for reasons we can discuss, but talent density is one of them, career opportunities. And then you end up working on AOL or, you know, again, Evernote. Some of these businesses, these people would then have applied if the whole prospect had been to work there for five years or ten years, but they are incredibly excited, and rightfully so, to spend, say, twelve months or eighteen months on AOL rebuilding the technological foundation, rethinking the customer experience, monetization, that's a very interesting challenge because you get to change a lot of stuff on a very large user and customer base. So you get the best of a startup and a big corp. From the big corp, get... We're working on big user and customer bases. This is not... We're not trying to find product market fit. We have a lot of resources. But from a startup, you have a tiny team, lots of responsibility, we're actually making big changes.
00:40:04 · Luca Ferrari, David Senra
We're not refining a button or trying to add the next 0.5% in revenue. We're trying to rebuild almost from the ground up in many cases. Going back to what are some of these executive teams from the acquired companies getting wrong? Well, they're often doing well, but they're... They can only work with the teams that realistically they can attract. And we are often able to bring in a lot of fresh talent with new perspectives and some excellent skills. And so it's a lot easier to rethink and rebuild these companies when you have access to this this talent pool. [00:40:38] S0: One of my biggest partners is Ramp, and I'm really close with the the founders there. And I was happy to be with them the night Eric? Eric and Kareem. [00:40:46] S1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:40:46 · Luca Ferrari, David Senra
[00:40:46] S1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [00:40:46] S0: When I was with Kareem the night that one of their main competitors, who they didn't even view as a competitor anymore, but everybody else said Brex got acquired. Kareem said something interesting. He's like, oh, you know, was like, oh, how do you think about this? He's just like, well, you know, there... People thought there was, like, a war between RAMP and Brex. He didn't. And he's like, well, if there was a war, it's definitely over now. And I go, why? He goes, best talent's not going to go to Virginia and go work for Capital One. He's like, we're going to keep getting better talent. And even if that, like, in that gap between, you know, the talent that we have and the talent that they're going to attract there, it's just like, it's like, you've played it out year one, year two, year three, five years from now. It's like, it's over. It's all about people. It's very similar to what you're saying. [00:41:25] S1: Yeah. I don't know their industry well, but it sounds possible. I I tend to agree with that.
00:41:29 · David Senra
[00:41:29] S0: Deal is how the best founders turn the world into their talent pool. I've been studying how history's greatest founders operate for a decade, and one thing they all have in common is they understand that recruiting and hiring the very best talent is your most important priority. A players recognize other a players, which is why top companies like Ramp, Shopify, Eleven Labs, Uber, and DoorDash all use Deal. Many of the top founders I know have personally invested in Deal after using their product. And what they discovered is that Deal is the best company in the world at building infrastructure for global hiring. Deal will help your business hire, pay, and manage any worker anywhere in the world so you can retain the best talent anywhere and spend the rest of your time focusing on what you do best, delivering value to your customers. The founder of Eleven Labs has a great description of the value Deal can give your company. He said, we built Eleven Labs to break down language and communication barriers. With Deal enabling us to hire and support exceptional talent anywhere, we can accelerate our innovation and bring more voices, stories, and ideas every corner of the world. Deal is trusted by over 40,000 businesses. Learn how they can help your business today by going to deal.com/senra. That is deal.com/senra. I wanna go back to this idea of saturating their capacity, because it's still one of the most interesting things you told me when we had lunch. So like, can you give me an example, okay? You talked about, you know, it's better to have no habits than bad habits. I'm gonna find graduates or, in some cases, people that haven't even graduated yet. They might start as, like, an intern or very entry level at Bending Spoons, and then you're like, oh, we identified this talented person. And what do mean by saturating their capacity? Like, give give, like, concrete examples of how you've