A Product Market Fit Show | Startup Podcast for Founders
00:47:08 · Pablo Srugo
[00:47:08] S2: simple question just on sequencing you talked about three kind of steps you get to 90% of value how quickly does that reset like I do three and then in the month no reply okay cool I put you in a pile at some point I'm going to hit you up again is that in six months in a year like what's the default there?
00:47:21 · Daniel Saks
[00:47:21] S0: it depends on how often you run through your list so for example one of my team members was doing outreach to the GTM owners at private equity to support their portfolio and maybe it took a couple weeks to burn through the list and what our AI would recommend is probably okay let's go back to the ones that are engaging that have you know we can see that they're opening emails or they're following up but the rest can go dormant for call it a quarter and then we can go back after them and if you have this live TAM map then you can see who you've penetrated so within each of these sub segments that you have I would want to look at okay if I want to dominate fractional SDRs how many are there? How many have I touched? How many have responded? How many of them are with competitors? And in the world of like a small enterprise TAM that knowledge is power so knowing okay I have a hundred enterprise companies that I can go after in manufacturing we've talked to 70% or we've reached out to 70% you know call it 50% have either said no or said yes you know of the ones that said no they told us why maybe it's like we're working with a competitor and it's a three year contract and then you can mark like okay in three years you know or call it two years so you have time to prep go back and if you're working within Claude Code and you have all this indexed Cloud will do this for you based on the way you can set up Landbase so I think if there were like call it maturities of sales development you know the old school way would have been go call from the phone book like I described manually dial you know the next would be you're using a zoom info to do the research you're maybe doing manual web research and then you're manually sending an email or LinkedIn or a call I think then the next would maturity would be call it go into clay pull in data sources have your TAM push that out I think the next frontier is just being native in Claude Code or Codex where you give it all the context and it's gonna run this for you live and it's gonna activate your TAM for you and the power of that is incredible and you would have previously needed a way way bigger team to be able to activate that whole TAM
00:49:26 · Pablo Srugo, Daniel Saks
[00:49:26] S2: what's one of the most common mistakes around outbound go to market that you see [00:49:31] S0: outbound is not it's like product market fit actually outbound is like product market fit it's not something that you have and it works forever you always have to be constantly experimenting so chances are with outbound the first things that you do whether it's the message the channel or the target it's gonna be wrong and you should be see yourself as like rapidly experimenting at low volumes until you have that pull and it's really not good to scale weak value prop or weak target because you're just gonna get flagged as spam and your email campaigns are gonna be burned and you're gonna have no success so I in fact tell a lot of startups don't do outbound until you have a really strong digital presence where people can look you up or look your company up and see hey this is really working so I think the biggest pitfall startups have is they'll approach spray and pray outbound early and set it all up and then say hey it's not working and then give up on it for years [00:50:26] S2: well let me ask you the flip side of that like imagine I said to you I've got there's a company has product market fit like just take it as given people like the product outbound is not working what is default for you it's like this is probably why obviously you haven't looked at it and there's different but like generally speaking what's the thing that they probably are not doing as well as they could
00:50:44 · Daniel Saks
[00:50:44] S0: the main thing yeah it's probably if you put all of that context into cloud and it can see your call notes and your connect rates and it can see your CRM records and win loss cloud can tell you you know here's why it's not working it's because of you're going after the wrong you know person wrong message less signal it's too competitive so for certain markets like recruiting if you're going out to a company and saying hey I can help recruit for you there's so many other recruiting messages that it just gets fallen in the mix so there's there's certain industries where this is tough and that's where AppDirect has indexed or sorry Landbase has indexed all this data and trained on it so we can tell you with context and cloud code like hey yeah the issue that you have here is you're going after the wrong ICP or it's too broad of a TAM or you're going after the wrong person within the right company or you know this is a market in which it's just overburdened with outbound and therefore it's really going to be hard to differentiate so you need to spend time with a unique value prop or hook so I think the key is if you're if you feel like you have product market fit and you're trying outbound and it's not working you've got to experiment a lot the other thing that I found is that if you have the average SDR that's been around for the last few years and they were built on the era where they spend 30% of their time filtering in ZoomInfo and call it 30% of their time on LinkedIn and email and like very little time calling you're going to have not a lot of success with calling so what I find is like calling is an art and people who like love and breathe calling you can feel their energy and they're going to be you know dialing they're going to be on it and that's probably 10% or less of the SDR pool so what we see is that email and LinkedIn are good but they're not going to be the best channel today the best channel today often is calling but you need a DNA of a caller so if you're a founder what I would say is you can automate the TAM mapping the email the list building using tools like Landbase and Claude Code and then you can focus on hiring SDRs that are going to be like these great callers and that's much better than just hiring an average SDR and telling them do everything and they do it the old way and that just doesn't scale
00:52:52 · Pablo Srugo, Daniel Saks
[00:52:52] S2: love it well Dan thanks for jumping on the show man it's been great [00:52:56] S0: yeah love chatting with you and feel free to reach out to me Daniel at Landbase.com or you can see us at Landbase.com or my LinkedIn so picture this [00:53:04] S2: it's months from now years from now and one of your founder friends a really close founder friends of yours guess what their startup went bankrupt and it turns out if you had just shared the product market fit show with them they would have learned everything they needed to to find product market fit and to create a huge success but instead their startup has completely failed you have blood on your hands don't let that happen you don't want to live like that it is terrible so do what you need to do tell them about the show send it to them put it on WhatsApp put it on Slack put it where you need to put it just make sure they know about it and they check it out on Slack on Slack