Riding Unicorns: Venture Capital | Entrepreneurship | Technology
00:06:27 · Alan Chang, James Pringle
[00:06:27] S1: Yeah. I would say it's all about the people. Right. So at the end the day, it's all about people, you know, building a great product, building a great service, working hard in the competition. Right. So for example, when I joined Revolut, it was so in this small co working space And essentially, it was a dedicated office, so it was just like hot desk. And I would say the Revolut team was the only team that really stayed after 7PM on weekdays, and also the only team that worked on weekends. Right. There was like probably several 100 startups in that group. I saw that, you know, literally first week. So, at that moment, it was very obvious to me. Know, regularly something special. You know, if you're up against the big guys, it's very hard to win if you don't work harder than you. They have more money than you. They have more people than you. They have more resources than you, more connections, etcetera, etcetera. And also, they have more time than you, right? So, your odds are really stacked against you. The only thing you can beat is you hire better people, and you work on it. [00:07:29] S0: I think that's really interesting. I mean, is that something that you think that the the founders tried to get right in the hiring process, or was it set post hiring in terms of, like, expectations? We just work harder, or do you think they they sort of hired people that they sort of knew would work that hard?
00:07:29 · James Pringle, Alan Chang
[00:07:29] S0: I think that's really interesting. I mean, is that something that you think that the the founders tried to get right in the hiring process, or was it set post hiring in terms of, like, expectations? We just work harder, or do you think they they sort of hired people that they sort of knew would work that hard? [00:07:47] S1: I think it's both. Both. Right? It's pretty clear in the interview process. This is not for everyone. I mean, and that's fair enough, right? Not everyone wants to do, you know, like working 20 fourseven. I mean, that's very fair. You can't build a gigantic company doing that. So I think, yeah, Niklas said, they're a very good job, you know, hiring great people. There's one to do that and basically setting the culture and setting the expectations to everyone. And if they did make the bar, they were out. [00:08:21] S0: Yeah. Nice. I think one of our previous guests described it as the the unsell in the hiring process where they actually try and convince you not to join for a period to make sure that you're you're bought into the right level. And so how have you found the move from being an early employee to at least scaling into a very big organization to to now being a founder? Like, what's the biggest difference? Have you enjoyed it all? Like, what's that experience been like?
00:08:21 · James Pringle, Alan Chang
[00:08:21] S0: Yeah. Nice. I think one of our previous guests described it as the the unsell in the hiring process where they actually try and convince you not to join for a period to make sure that you're you're bought into the right level. And so how have you found the move from being an early employee to at least scaling into a very big organization to to now being a founder? Like, what's the biggest difference? Have you enjoyed it all? Like, what's that experience been like? [00:08:50] S1: I mean, for me, I I really think the... I know a lot of people ask me that question. Like, for me, it's really the same. Like, I mean, for me, I'm always, a problem solver at heart. Right? I love solving problems, I'm just solving a different problem. Right? So, yeah, for me, it's it's largely the same. Right? And the only difference, I guess, is the different industry. But in terms of actual experience, like, I feel like it's very much the same. [00:09:18] S0: And your cofounder was also Revolut. How did you guys... What was the moment where you went... Looked at each other and went, we're gonna do this? Like, then we're gonna do a business together. What was that kind of coming together like?
00:09:18 · James Pringle, Alan Chang
[00:09:18] S0: And your cofounder was also Revolut. How did you guys... What was the moment where you went... Looked at each other and went, we're gonna do this? Like, then we're gonna do a business together. What was that kind of coming together like? [00:09:29] S1: Yeah. So, yeah, I I actually hired him at, We always worked well along with each other. But then he went to do some investing for two years, what I like to call like semi retirement. And then we just, you know, basically he was bored and then I wanted to solve an IBM Dager problem, right? And then we started discussing, we bounced some ideas off each other and then we accidentally stumbled onto this battery company that was making a lot of money. And we were like, how can you make money from batteries? Like, we just didn't understand anything. Right? And then we started digging into energy. Then then a year later we decided, you know, let's give it a shot.
00:09:29 · Alan Chang, Hector Mason
[00:09:29] S1: Yeah. So, yeah, I I actually hired him at, We always worked well along with each other. But then he went to do some investing for two years, what I like to call like semi retirement. And then we just, you know, basically he was bored and then I wanted to solve an IBM Dager problem, right? And then we started discussing, we bounced some ideas off each other and then we accidentally stumbled onto this battery company that was making a lot of money. And we were like, how can you make money from batteries? Like, we just didn't understand anything. Right? And then we started digging into energy. Then then a year later we decided, you know, let's give it a shot. [00:10:09] S2: Yeah. And how have you how have you found that time in as a green energy company? You know, now you spend a bit of time there researching, exploring, learning. Has your has your view of the market changed at all since since starting a business? It's it's quite different from an outside... Being an insider versus looking at it from the outside. The solution you're building seems obvious, and it seems like something that would make sense. But I think it's it's it's easy to underestimate the complexity of the the power grid. Right? And so so I just wonder, you know, how you found that, whether actually you've kind of peeled back a few layers of the onion and and just found found a mess that's much harder to work with than you're expecting.
00:10:49 · Alan Chang, Hector Mason
[00:10:49] S1: For sure. For sure. I think energy markets is very, very complicated. There is a lot of like, because the problem is it's physical, right? So you start with actual generation. So it's like a physical engineering component, and then you have the grid, which is also a physical a physical thing and has a lot of constraints and limitations. And then you also have to consider, for example, permitting, right, which the local government wants, I would say. And then you have the financial markets of energy, right, which is not super efficient, And there are also a lot of problems in it. So I would say, yes, there is a lot of complexity. I would say a lot more than finance. But I think what we've done at Revlon, right, is we've abstracted all the complexity away from the customer. So for the customer, it's just one button. The thing we're doing, we're maintaining this similar philosophy, like we are abstracting complexity away from the customer. So for the customer, it's just one button. So I would say it's a lot more details and complexity than we originally anticipated, but they were all... They all solve the problems. [00:11:57] S2: How are you getting up to speed with the complexity? Like, how how do you do you build a team around you who understands it better than you, or are you having to bury yourself in reports, research?