00:42:00 · Jordi Hays, John Coogan
[00:42:00] S0: Fifteen milliseconds additional is too high. That's the type of ping that'll get you killed in [00:42:04] S1: Counter Strike. Counter Strike. That's true. That's true. You need under ten seconds for ultimate fragging. I agree. Well, let me tell you about Public. Invest across all asset classes, automate anything with AI agents, run trading strategies, risk management, money movements, monitor markets with AI agents for investing on public. [00:42:21] S0: Instinct. Lucas. Oh. Please. The grub... Grubber inator. Lucas Grubber. [00:42:26] S1: Grubber inator. [00:42:27] S0: Says Grubber. Instinct is currently raising at 30,000,000,000. A 100 to 500 to 2.5 to 10 to 30 in sub one year. If you're still not inside the private market, this should be a good signal to pivot aggressively. Wealth creation is gonna be heavily skewed towards private investors over the coming decade. [00:42:48] S1: TBP? [00:42:52] S0: Yes, [00:42:53] S1: yes, There is more risk and there is more reward, and so that's why venture capital firms diversify and LPs diversify across venture funds, but it is Yeah. So people [00:43:04] S0: people are naturally crashing out over this. Not not even the take that's that's that's embedded in this post. Yeah. Just just that trajectory. [00:43:14] S1: Yeah. [00:43:17] S0: It is insanely aggressive, if it's true. But, again, this business has been growing so rapidly. [00:43:24] S1: Yeah.
00:43:24 · John Coogan, Jordi Hays, Mark Gurman
[00:43:24] S1: Yeah. [00:43:25] S0: And the interesting thing is, like, it's very hard to judge Instinct's growth relative to Muse simply because Instinct doesn't have an app. So it'd be really fascinating to see like [00:43:34] S1: The App Store. [00:43:35] S0: Where would they sit in the App Store rankings. Right? [00:43:38] S1: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What is what is Muse doing on App Store ratings right now? Because it was at the top of the App Store for a while. [00:43:45] S0: Right now, have TikTok Pro. Muse. Muse. Muse. Muse. Course. [00:43:49] S1: Muse is being, like, promoted in the App Store. If you just go to the search button, Muse is right there. It's doing well. It has 380,000 ratings, almost all five stars, 4.9 average. So, it's number one in productivity, but not number one overall because TikTok Pro is [00:44:05] S0: And Vinted, of course. Vinted. [00:44:09] S1: Yeah. Vinted. I was on Vinted. I I was looking at some stuff. Picking up some picking up some Rick Owens head to toe. It's coming. It's coming. Jordi said I couldn't be a lifestyle influencer, but I think if I pull up in the Rick Owens, the Supreme, the Bottega top hat, you're gonna be apologizing. [00:44:28] S0: I didn't say I just said couldn't. I just I just [00:44:32] S1: You literally said you said, you should lean into comedy. And I'm like... And then and then my counterexample is just a bunch more comedy. [00:44:39] S7: Yeah. [00:44:39] S1: It's so unmarried. A 100%. Anyway, you can now text your dot. Yeah. So there are a ton of these AI agents that everyone sees.
00:44:39 · John Coogan, Jordi Hays, Mark Gurman
[00:44:39] S1: It's so unmarried. A 100%. Anyway, you can now text your dot. Yeah. So there are a ton of these AI agents that everyone sees. [00:44:47] S0: Anyways. Anyways. So the other thing with NSYNC is like so few people have real information around the business Yeah. That it's impossible to... Everyone can give a take Sure. Right? Because the number has... The valuation has grown so quickly, so fast. Mhmm. But it's just really tough when you don't have the information, right? So you're just... It's entirely... Investors are making a decision based on what they're seeing in the business. Everyone else is giving takes based on how they feel about the number going up really fast. Yeah. And, yeah, it's hard it's hard to it's hard to see exactly like what you can only imagine kind of the way that they're positioning the business, how they're... What what Noah's vision is and all that kind [00:45:32] S7: of thing. [00:45:32] S0: Yeah.
00:45:33 · John Coogan
[00:45:33] S1: But It also highlights, like, when new capability comes online from a Frontier lab, it can be at the frontier of that new capability. But unless there is a commensurate marketing push, it not... It's not guaranteed that it gets adoption because you only have so much screen real estate in the ChatGPT app, in the Claude app. Anthropic has Duet now. I saw the announcement, but I haven't seen a lot of advertising around it. And so there's plenty of people that are like, oh, yeah. I have clogged code in my terminal, but, like, I'm a Muse guy. Or, like, I use Grok bot in Slack, but then I use Codex for coding. And... Or I'm cursor over here and instinct in my personal life. And there's so much effort that needs to go in. And so instinct is at least focused on, like, let's get this value prop in front of people. And and I think that's sort of, like, the value of, like, maybe it's oligopolistic, maybe it's a big market, maybe there is a winner take all. Like, all the investors are still, like, piecing that together, but they're just seeing, like, incredible growth. Everyone we've talked to has been, like, the charts are incredible. Like, every every month is just huge growth, even on... Even while being attacked by Mark Zuckerberg, being attacked by Dot and and Duo. Like, there's a whole bunch of other companies going after this. I have to imagine Google is gonna do something soon. They've launched similar products in the past, and it's so in line with them. They already have your email. They have Google Maps that has all your reservations. They own they own the Michelin Guide, I think. Or it's not Michelin. It's the... Some some star rating service that's like Zagat. Is that it? You know that one?
00:47:12 · Jordi Hays, John Coogan, Ben Liu, S2, Mark Gurman
[00:47:12] S0: Yeah. I don't know if you know him. [00:47:14] S1: But they bought they bought like a like a restaurant review [00:47:17] S6: Yeah. [00:47:17] S1: Like brand. And so they have a ton of advantages there. They have Google Voice. They've done service to make calls on your behalf already, like years and years ago with AI. What what is Zagat. Zagat? Is that how you pronounce it? [00:47:29] S2: Z g a t. [00:47:31] S1: Yeah. And so they they have so much infrastructure, but they're always a little bit slower on the product side than like an Instinct, which is just a couple people moving really fast. So... [00:47:39] S0: Yeah. The crazy thing is compare Instinct. Yeah. Instinct, if they're raising at 30,000,000,000 to where Cursor was when they were raising at 30, which like massive competition from the labs. Yep. And some questions around how they would how... Yeah. How they would handle that that competition basically competing with their suppliers. Yep. Right? In some ways. But I believe at the time, Cursor had like north of a billion dollars of revenue. They're [00:48:04] S1: worried about the margins. [00:48:05] S0: Right? Yeah. Their margins weren't great, but at least people were giving them like billions of dollars. Totally. [00:48:09] S1: Right? And that's not [00:48:10] S7: happening. [00:48:10] S0: And so with instinct, part of what's jarring is that you have the same level of competition and potentially even more. Right? Because it's like you have the major AI players. There's like... You have the major AI players, then you also have Zach saying...
00:48:10 · Jordi Hays, John Coogan
[00:48:10] S0: And so with instinct, part of what's jarring is that you have the same level of competition and potentially even more. Right? Because it's like you have the major AI players. There's like... You have the major AI players, then you also have Zach saying... [00:48:23] S1: With Cursor, it was like Cursor was the lead IDE, and then you had Windsurf coming from behind nipping at their heels. But you didn't really have a product that was a direct competitor from OpenAI or Anthropic or Google, really. Right? In, like, the... [00:48:37] S0: Yeah. And so the ToClock code and codex. [00:48:39] S1: But those were those were terminal agents. And and they did disrupt. [00:48:43] S0: I'm saying they're ultimately competing out over the same Totally. Totally. You know.