01:50:52 · John Coogan, Ben Liu, Jordi Hays
[01:50:52] S1: Yeah. [01:50:52] S6: But I think you bring up a point. Like, biotech's really an efficient stay because, you know, you're you're really scaling with humans, and there's an opportunity to build AI systems that do the work work work of entire teams. And so a pharma company is a 100,000 people because in order to prosecute one idea, you need a team of people to go after that. And and so we built, like, AI systems that let you exhaustively look at every single drug and target indication pair, and then, you know, design the right try... Trials, run it kind of cheaper and faster. But you also don't have to create a separate team for each asset. And so biotechs today, like, you almost have to have, like, you know, a CMO, chief development officer, head of quality, and and and they're underleveraged in some ways. [01:51:29] S1: Sure. [01:51:29] S6: So if you can kind of have the best human talent with these AI systems, you can prosecute 10, 15, 20 [01:51:35] S1: Yeah. [01:51:35] S6: You know, 50 drugs and not have to be, you know, a 100,000 person company. It's a few 100 people. [01:51:41] S1: That's what we're really excited about. [01:51:43] S0: $100,000,000. Gong. Gong. [01:51:46] S1: Thank you so much for coming coming on the show. Congratulations. [01:51:49] S0: Final... Last last last question. [01:51:51] S1: This is fascinating. Please. Would [01:51:53] S0: you rather have 30,000 monkeys or 30,000 Bitcoin? [01:51:59] S6: I think the monkeys will ultimately...
01:51:59 · Ben Liu, Jordi Hays, John Coogan, Jasper Zhang, Amiram Shachar
[01:51:59] S6: I think the monkeys will ultimately... [01:52:04] S0: I think buy and hold the monkeys. Think they might I think they might... I think the monkey market might rip harder than... [01:52:10] S1: You think monkey... There... There's gonna be the flipping. [01:52:12] S0: Because... That's what they [01:52:12] S1: call it, flipping. [01:52:13] S0: With with crypto, you have so much, like, just, like, cyber risk right now whereas [01:52:18] S1: Oh, so if you're so if you're you're holding on a bored ape, you wanna get out of bored apes and get into real apes. [01:52:23] S4: Yeah. [01:52:23] S1: I think that might be the future. A lot of monkey business going on. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show. [01:52:28] S0: Very cool business, Ben. Have Coming back on soon. [01:52:30] S1: Rest of your day and congratulations. Goodbye. Up next, we are running a little bit late, but we're bringing in the cofounder and CEO of Upwind. We have Amiram. Welcome to the show. The first appearance with a massive Here he from Bessemer. How are doing? Welcome to the show. Please introduce yourself and the company. [01:52:49] S9: Hey, guys. Amiram here. Thank you for having me. Cofounder, CEO of Upwind. Yeah. Very glad to be here. [01:52:57] S1: Amazing. And, introduce the business. What is the elevator pitch, the logline these days? [01:53:02] S9: Upwind protects the cloud and AI for the world. Sure. There is a lot of cloud infrastructure out there, a lot of AI usage. [01:53:10] S1: Yeah.
01:53:10 · John Coogan, Amiram Shachar
[01:53:10] S1: Yeah. [01:53:11] S9: And Upwind has built a platform that secures all of it from the entire life cycle. We've been around since 2023 and growing fast. [01:53:22] S1: Super important. I can imagine you're growing very, very fast. What is the actual go to market motion like today? I mean, cybersecurity is on the top of everyone's mind. Ilya Sutskever is tweeting about how neo clouds need better cybersecurity. Is is it just, buy, buy, everyone just pulling every tool in, or are you actually going up against other cybersecurity firms for rip and replace? Are you additive? How do you plug in and just wind up achieving the mission of securing infrastructure more broadly? [01:53:55] S9: Yes. I think first is cybersecurity is having a big moment with AI. Yeah. Alright. Let's face it. Every, like, person is a hacker Yeah. With, like, open source models. Like, you get the damage you can create [01:54:08] S1: Yeah. [01:54:09] S9: And let alone, like, the people who really wanna create damage. Like, you know, a lot of enterprises are target for attackers. Yeah. We're, like, in a very, like, complex geopolitical situation in the world. So, like, there is a lot of things, like, that are happening on the cybersecurity front, and AI just makes it, like, stimulating it. [01:54:27] S1: Yeah.
01:54:27 · John Coogan, Amiram Shachar
[01:54:27] S1: Yeah. [01:54:28] S9: And the way we're thinking about it is basically the way to secure it is really about the platform approach because if you think about the average CISO, when they need to buy a security tool, how much real estate do you really have to deploy all these thousands of vendors? So we've been taking a platform approach that can actually take you all the way from protecting secure development, secure deployment in the cloud, secure runtime in the cloud, and now AI lives everywhere. So we are really coming against, like, to your question, against the platforms, like the big platforms, and we think that's the right place to be because this is what customers really want. [01:55:08] S1: Is your experience at Spot, and maybe you can tell the audience what you were doing there, relevant here because you've seen the nature of, enterprise cloud surface areas, and so you know what solutions will, be adopted most aggressively? [01:55:24] S9: You know, when when I go on a on a call with customers Yeah. And they ask me, what's unique about Upwind? What's... Can you tell us what's what's the differentiation of Upwind? So I tell them the first thing is that we're not coming from cybersecurity background. [01:55:35] S1: Yeah. [01:55:36] S9: We're building a cybersecurity company, not with cybersecurity background. Like, our background is from, like, you know, DevOps and infrastructure. We had a company before called Spot. Io. We helped thousands of organizations to scale their compute infrastructure efficiently on AWS, on Azure, on GCP. [01:55:53] S1: Mhmm.
01:55:53 · John Coogan, Amiram Shachar
[01:55:53] S1: Mhmm. [01:55:54] S9: And that knowledge of understanding how DevOps people think, how infrastructure is wired Yeah. How CloudOps is working, it's helping us to, like like help security team unlock context of operations that they never had before. And that's actually the X factor of solving, like taking a problem from like a like a security finding and alert into, like, a real... Something that I really understand the risk and I can really fix it. [01:56:21] S1: Mhmm. How is, how is... Like, what is the state of vibe coding right now that we we all kind of predicted that, you know, there'd be tons of slop and stuff would might start breaking and it's kind of happening, but it's not even fully... I I I I don't think it's fair to put the blame for some of these cybersecurity attacks on vibe coding. A lot of people have... Are breaking into systems that are just like, yeah. Actually, it's just somebody who was running PHP and the normal, like, lamp lamp stack. They didn't vibe code anything because they built it ten years ago, now they're vulnerable. And so when you're talking to CEOs, CIOs, what are the threat models that they're most worried about today?
01:56:21 · John Coogan, Amiram Shachar, Jordi Hays
[01:56:21] S1: Mhmm. How is, how is... Like, what is the state of vibe coding right now that we we all kind of predicted that, you know, there'd be tons of slop and stuff would might start breaking and it's kind of happening, but it's not even fully... I I I I don't think it's fair to put the blame for some of these cybersecurity attacks on vibe coding. A lot of people have... Are breaking into systems that are just like, yeah. Actually, it's just somebody who was running PHP and the normal, like, lamp lamp stack. They didn't vibe code anything because they built it ten years ago, now they're vulnerable. And so when you're talking to CEOs, CIOs, what are the threat models that they're most worried about today? [01:57:01] S9: You know what? I'll just tell you, like, a funny story. Like, we had last week. We had, like, a really important feature that I wanted to be deployed as soon as possible. Sure. So I went to the developer, I said, I'm gonna go on a on a Zoom with you right now to make sure, like, we're deploying it Mhmm. Because there's, like, some, you know, final things. And then I go on a call, he's sharing my... The screen, and I tell him, like, change this, do that. Mhmm. And then the guy doesn't write code. [01:57:27] S1: He's just prompting? [01:57:28] S9: He's like Yeah. It's just like prompting. Yeah. It's like, change this, do that. [01:57:32] S1: Sounds like [01:57:33] S0: somebody out of the [01:57:33] S1: office space. [01:57:34] S0: Shouldn't have done that. [01:57:35] S1: So your job is to take the prompt from the CEO and give it to Codex and Claude Code.