A Product Market Fit Show | Startup Podcast for Founders
00:21:28 · Pablo Srugo, Rahul Shivkumar
[00:21:28] S0: Walk me through, like actually, if you don't mind going deeper on that, like the ROI of it, right? So like if somebody spends, what's your ACV today? Let's say it's 100K? Is it more? [00:21:36] S1: Yeah, it's in the six figures, yeah. [00:21:37] S0: So let's say it's 100K. Like maybe you could do it at the unit level, you know, per doctor. Like how much time does it take to onboard a doctor? Therefore, how much does it cost? Versus, you know, using a shirt, like whatever, however you do the ROI math.
00:21:37 · Pablo Srugo, Rahul Shivkumar
[00:21:37] S0: So let's say it's 100K. Like maybe you could do it at the unit level, you know, per doctor. Like how much time does it take to onboard a doctor? Therefore, how much does it cost? Versus, you know, using a shirt, like whatever, however you do the ROI math. [00:21:49] S1: Totally. I'll take maybe a specific example of like a dermatologist, right? And the reason I'm picking them is because each day they're kind of sitting on a bench, they're actually losing out on a lot that they could be billing, right? Like that becomes a reasonably important factor, which is, hey, if I am a professional that bills a lot every day, like $5,000, $10,000 a day, right? Then if I'm delayed by 20 days, my organization is missing out on $50,000, right? There's like a top line ROI that they're missing out on. And then on the back end, if I have to submit 120 forms, I have to follow up every week, either over a phone call or an email for these 120. And I have like an error rate of 5%, right? Like where maybe I like typo something or I miss a phone call because, you know, I'm out of office for a week. That could cause delays. That adds up to the number of days that I actually can't see a patient, but also it adds labor costs where there's a person on my side that has to do all these things, right? So when we think of ROI, we think of it as a combination of two things. It's one, can we activate your provider faster in these days? Can we get you 10 more billable days, 20 more billable days? How many providers can we do this for?
00:21:49 · Rahul Shivkumar, Pablo Srugo
[00:21:49] S1: Totally. I'll take maybe a specific example of like a dermatologist, right? And the reason I'm picking them is because each day they're kind of sitting on a bench, they're actually losing out on a lot that they could be billing, right? Like that becomes a reasonably important factor, which is, hey, if I am a professional that bills a lot every day, like $5,000, $10,000 a day, right? Then if I'm delayed by 20 days, my organization is missing out on $50,000, right? There's like a top line ROI that they're missing out on. And then on the back end, if I have to submit 120 forms, I have to follow up every week, either over a phone call or an email for these 120. And I have like an error rate of 5%, right? Like where maybe I like typo something or I miss a phone call because, you know, I'm out of office for a week. That could cause delays. That adds up to the number of days that I actually can't see a patient, but also it adds labor costs where there's a person on my side that has to do all these things, right? So when we think of ROI, we think of it as a combination of two things. It's one, can we activate your provider faster in these days? Can we get you 10 more billable days, 20 more billable days? How many providers can we do this for? [00:22:58] S0: Yeah, that's the question. How much faster do you typically get people onboarded? [00:23:01] S1: About 30% faster right now. [00:23:03] S0: And usually it's what, 15 days down to 10 days or what's the normal?
00:23:03 · Pablo Srugo, Rahul Shivkumar
[00:23:03] S0: And usually it's what, 15 days down to 10 days or what's the normal? [00:23:07] S1: It varies so much across every single state, but if I were to take like an average time, it probably goes down from like about 90 days to 65, 60 to 65. [00:23:17] S0: Okay, so you're getting somebody like 30 more billable days. [00:23:19] S1: Exactly. Yeah, and again, for specialties, it differs, in states it differs, it's such a hard thing to quantify, but I think when we sampled our data across every single specialty, every single state and insurance company came out at about 30%. We have tens of thousands
00:23:34 · Pablo Srugo
[00:23:34] S0: of people who have followed the show. Are you one of those people? You want to be a part of the group. You want to be a part of those tens of thousands of followers. So hit the follow button. You know, I wanted to get to that because I was trying to figure out like, where's the pull? Why is there so much pull here? And when you think about, there's the back office side, right? The labor that it takes. You're like, okay, I get it. There's a person doing that, maybe many people in a big organization, but like how much can that really cost, right? And then you spend a hundred K on something else. It's like, but once you start talking about revenue and revenue generation, I always find if you can have a real claim to more revenue, it's just so appealing. Every business wants to make more revenue, whereas not every business wants fewer costs. Like in theory, they do, but if it means firing someone, I don't know, right? It can mean all these implications that it's not, whereas we can give them more revenue, like it's a no brainer, right? By decreasing the delay, like from 90 to 60, you get somebody 30 more billable days. And you're talking about, let's say 10,000 a day, which is like obviously on the high end. That's 300K times the number of doctors. If it's on the low end, maybe it's 30K times the number of doctors. 10 doctors a month or back to 300K to $3 million that you're making from them every month. That is something that's hard to say no to, right? Whereas it's a lot easier to say, I know, you know what? Johnny's been working here for like five years. I don't want to fire Johnny. And like, you know, yeah, maybe Johnny could do it in half the time, but what's he going to do without the half time? Like whatever, you know, it just becomes a little bit more questionable. I don't know if that's true. That resonates. That's just my kind of on the outside looking in. I feel like reducing that delay and getting them more revenue feels like a pretty crazy ROI.
00:25:00 · Rahul Shivkumar, Pablo Srugo
[00:25:00] S1: Yeah. That argument works super well for one segment of our ICP. You'd be surprised actually for another segment of our ICP actually doesn't land at all. Interesting. Where they go, hey, look, we have enough providers where getting them in faster doesn't really matter that much for us. [00:25:16] S0: Because it doesn't translate to revenue. Correct. Okay. That makes sense. [00:25:19] S1: You want to be like very careful. Like this is one thing like we've pushed so heavily on our go-to-market team, which is like really, really, really understand like why a buyer would want a shirt, right? Like this revenue argument makes total sense, but they might come back and say like, look, we don't have enough patient demand as an example, right? So what we're doing is we're just pushing more of these patients to an existing provider. So even if it takes 30 more days, that's not a lot. [00:25:45] S0: We're not losing much. [00:25:45] S1: Correct. And then that just falls on its face. And you basically like blown that deal, right? [00:25:51] S0: And then why would they buy you though? If they don't need them to come in faster?