Invest Like the Best with Patrick O'Shaughnessy
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Josh Kushner
[00:00:00] S0: Nonetheless, sometimes you're in your lane – someone else comes in and they swim into the lane. There are competitive deals that you want to win, I'm sure, that other great firms also want to win. How do you win when you want to? [00:00:00] S1: The ethos of the firm is never sell against anyone else. There are truly a lot of firms that we respect deeply, and we will never compare ourselves to anyone else. What we like to do is just express to people that this is who we are. These are the types of values that we represent. These are the types of things that we can do for you. Other firms can do other things as well, but we try our best to make it about ourselves and what we can do, as opposed to us versus anyone else, and just give it to the entrepreneur for them to ultimately decide. [00:00:00] S0: Tell me about loyalty as a concept. [00:00:00] S1: It's been very hard at times to see people act in ways that don't necessarily resonate with the ethics and values of Thrive. And as I've expressed to you sometimes before, perhaps Thrive will be less successful because we're not willing to do the things that other people are willing to do. But it depends on how you define success. We really try our best to be positive sum, but also at the same time, if you're on our team, you're on our team. And if you decide not to be on our team, that's fine as well. [00:00:00] S0: What's something you'd be unwilling to do that you've seen others willing to do? What’s an example of that?
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Josh Kushner
[00:00:00] S0: What's something you'd be unwilling to do that you've seen others willing to do? What’s an example of that? [00:00:00] S1: I believe that my word, the word of the firm is more important than anything else. And if I commit to someone that I'm going to be by their side, I'm going to be by their side. We don't invest in competitive businesses. I've always fundamentally believed that that notion is more important than whatever the ultimate trade is. I think it's important that we always think about the industry in a positive sum capacity, but also at the same time, I think it's fundamentally important that we also hold our ground. And a line that I've used to the team before is, “kindness without toughness falters, and toughness without kindness corrodes.” [00:00:00] S0: Do you think of the words that could be used to describe you that ferocious is a fair one? [00:00:00] S1: There's a lot of passion in what we do every day, and we want to be the best that we possibly can. Define it however you want. [00:00:00] S0: Trust is something I'm always interested in. Has it become harder or easier for you to trust people with your success? [00:00:00] S1: I don't think we've achieved much, but I'm a trust by default person. But if someone breaks that trust, they’re out. [00:00:00] S0: What's the best way to build it?
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Josh Kushner
[00:00:00] S0: What's the best way to build it? [00:00:00] S1: I really believe in humanity. I really believe that people were created to be good. People can grow. People can always aspire to be better. So, I think seeing people for who they are in the best versions of themselves is the best way to build it. And to be honest, to live your life in a certain way. The only way to create trust with someone is to be trustworthy, to make sure that they know where you stand on something. That doesn't mean we're not all human, and that we don't all make mistakes, but I think that's the way in which I've gone about it. [00:00:00] S0: You just had a daughter whose name is Rae. Rae was your grandma's name. And your grandma, I did not fully appreciate until recently when I learned more about it, led an absolutely insane life and story. Maybe say a little bit about her significance in your life and the significance of that story in your life.
· Josh Kushner
[00:00:00] S1: My grandmother was a very special person to me. She was an absolute hero in my eyes. I feel so lucky to have the opportunity to honor her with the name of our child. Her story is really one of impossibility and resilience and perseverance. She grew up in a small town in Belarus, was put into a ghetto with a bunch of other Jews, dug a tunnel with other people in her town to escape, with a spoon. 600 feet. After experiencing and witnessing her sister get murdered, her mother get murdered before her eyes, to escape into the forest, to live with the Bielski partisans. To come to America with my grandfather, and nothing with the exception of the shirts on their back. The thing that my grandmother provides the most for me is just perspective, which is nothing I will ever go through in life will be as hard as what she went through. To see her family murdered, to escape in the way in which she did, to live in the Polish-Belarusian Forest for years, to live in a refugee camp for four years, to have to start anew in this country. There's no amount of pain that I can ever experience that will ever amount to what she has and whenever there's a difficult situation that I face, I always try my best to put it into perspective. More importantly in a very humbling way, there's nothing I will ever accomplish in life that will be greater than what she pulled off. Most people would break in that situation. I'm very proud of what I've done at Thrive, the personal life that I'm living, and I hope she's looking down and is proud of me as well. But nothing I will ever do will equate to what she has accomplished.
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Josh Kushner
[00:00:00] S0: You sent me an article about this rabbi, Rabbi Teitz. In the continuation of that story, where he served as a bridge for people coming from Europe to America, what did you learn from him, his story and how it relates to the American dream? There seems to be a little bit of a subtext of both Thrive and the companies that you back and the people you back. [00:00:00] S1: There was this group of people that I grew up with, they called them the Holocaust Builders. This group of people came from nothing. They all started at the ground floor. My grandfather was a laborer on construction sites. They were just able to build lives for themselves. I feel so lucky because I grew up in and around these people. They were such a huge part of my childhood, and that's why I think I'm so attracted to a lot of the people that work at Thrive, because there are similar stories. A lot of people at Thrive have come from very humble beginnings and they have their own versions of the experience that I had. I don't know how I can teach what I experienced to my children, but I'm very determined to try and express to them that what we have, living in this extraordinary country, is not something that we can ever take for granted.
· Josh Kushner, Patrick O'Shaughnessy
[00:00:00] S1: There was this group of people that I grew up with, they called them the Holocaust Builders. This group of people came from nothing. They all started at the ground floor. My grandfather was a laborer on construction sites. They were just able to build lives for themselves. I feel so lucky because I grew up in and around these people. They were such a huge part of my childhood, and that's why I think I'm so attracted to a lot of the people that work at Thrive, because there are similar stories. A lot of people at Thrive have come from very humble beginnings and they have their own versions of the experience that I had. I don't know how I can teach what I experienced to my children, but I'm very determined to try and express to them that what we have, living in this extraordinary country, is not something that we can ever take for granted. [00:00:00] S0: It's kind of wild to think about where things might go, since you couldn't have imagined being in this specific situation 15 years ago or whenever – what 15 years hence might look like. What inspiration do you draw from people totally afield? I know you love Frank Ocean. I know you love The Beatles. I know you love James Turrell. I know you love all these fascinating artists and creators that would listen to this and it would sound like Greek to them. They don't know what the hell we're talking about, yet they're people you respect and have been inspired by. Whether it's that list or others that come to mind, who else inspires you thinking ahead to the next 15 years?