Fintech Insider Podcast by 11:FS
00:32:53 · Kate Moody
[00:32:53] S2: Oh, you've just picked me because I was pulling visibly confused faces I think, yeah, gosh, it's a really tough question to answer. I suppose I try to think back to where have we seen some of the biggest initiatives and the biggest changes happening in the last few years in financial services, and certainly again, Benjamin Ross might have different opinions, but I think where we've seen some the biggest positive initiatives, it seems to have come from you, as Benjamin was alluding to, this kind of re synced up view between financial regulators but also government, other kind of different organisations, things like the rollout of open banking in The UK, new PIX in Brazil, other payment initiatives kind of at national scales, which have fundamentally challenged systemic issues in how those processes are working, where the fees are being charged, etcetera. So I do think maybe that is, you know, as Benjamin was alluding to, that's probably where one of the biggest challenges has been for other areas is that they haven't necessarily had these big issues that require really joined up responses. And yes, that's happened in a few areas but we haven't seen that happen across the whole spectrum of financial services yet. And it's very difficult for even, you know, for very well intentioned individuals within individual organizations that we see on here all the time in our work, it's quite difficult to make the case to be like the only bank or the only Fintech that is stepping forth and doing something which fundamentally challenges existing industry norms, product norms, custom norms. Sometimes these steps have to happen sort of more overall national, international level for them to be successful.
00:34:28 · Sarah Kocianski
[00:34:28] S4: That's fair. The... I think it would be fair to say that the whole industry, every different part of the industry and every different aspect of the ecosystem has a part to play. It's just not quite clear yet whose role is which, I suppose, would be the fair thing to say at this point. Ross, what about you? What do you think is the biggest barrier to banks being better incentivized to help customers build stronger financial futures?
00:34:50 · Ross Gallagher
[00:34:50] S5: I think it's really interesting, Sarah, because I think there's kind of like probably the answer for right now, and then that answer is probably fundamentally different in a couple of years time with the advent of AI. I think if you're looking at it right now, I think it's taking that longer term horizon in terms of how we think about the value we realize from relationships with our customers. You know, I think when you're constantly thinking about in your return and P and L and all of that sort of stuff, I think that fundamentally skews how we engage with customers. I think it fundamentally skews what we think about that relationship. And I think it fundamentally skews some of the decisions we make, etcetera. I think if you start to zoom out and start to think about value differently and you start to factor in things like engagement, start to factor in things like loyalty, and I think you start to think about, okay, well, fundamentally, how does that then transform the outcomes we can deliver for customers over a longer time horizon? I think you can start to build up a better picture holistically of their financial lives, it becomes a lot less fragmented. And then I think over time, actually, there's more value that you can realize by having that holistic picture. I think that's the answer for right now. What does that look like in two or five years time if people are just using, you know, sort of whatever their own chatbot agent is and they're not necessarily actually engaging with your digital channels, for example, directly and they're doing it all through the agent. I think that's a fundamentally different picture. Are apps even gonna be relevant, you know, in five years time in terms of any one financial institutions app like TBD? Maybe that's a different show, though.
00:36:42 · Sarah Kocianski, Benjamin Ensor, Kate Moody
[00:36:42] S4: I think we have given the producers ideas for many, many different shows throughout the course of this episode, so I don't know whether they will be praising us or cursing us. Benjamin, how about you? What do you think is the biggest barrier to ensuring AI benefits customers? [00:36:58] S6: I I think the biggest barrier is, I mean, problem is the bad actors. The reason that bad actors can get at customers and cause harm is because currently, there's no regulation that I'm aware of preventing non financial firms from using AI to provide financial advice. So let's take Meta as an example. Meta is a big company and have big AI engines, but it's not regulated as a financial intermediary. Yet Meta's muse is allowed to provide financial advice and guidance. So just it's riding a coaching horses through the regulatory infrastructure that's developed in countries all around the world. So I think the first thing you've got to do is you've got to say, Well, if you're providing financial advice or guidance through AI, you need to be regulated. If you're not regulated, that is illegal. But that requires action by legislatures all around the world. But that would be my wish. [00:37:58] S4: Perfect. Okay, I think we've covered an awful lot today. I just want to check if anybody has any final thoughts, any final wishes you didn't get a chance to tell us about today? Basically, I'm just giving the producers the next episode's, talking points. So anybody got any final wishes? [00:38:16] S2: Oh gosh. I mean, we allowed to just go into them in detail or just at high level?
00:38:16 · Kate Moody, Sarah Kocianski, Ross Gallagher
[00:38:16] S2: Oh gosh. I mean, we allowed to just go into them in detail or just at high level? [00:38:21] S4: You've got two minutes. So [00:38:22] S2: Oh, right. [00:38:23] S5: Do with [00:38:23] S4: what that what you can. [00:38:24] S2: Well, mean, if we had a a unlimited amount of time, sure there's all sorts of things we could cover. I feel like when we were like bouncing ideas before the show, I think I've just talked about trying to make pensions less boring. So I felt like that's that feels like it's something that again, we probably, probably couldn't probably have in the past, spent a lot more time talking about, but yeah, that would be, that would be, I mean, wish number one, obviously reduce household spending, wish number two, make it easy to talk about money, wish number three, pension's less boring. [00:38:48] S4: Ross, any others on your top three that had to be culled for the sake of time? [00:38:52] S5: Well, actually, going off the strength, Sarah, of your performance, my wish is gonna be that we bring you back into the hosting seat on a... An ongoing and permanent basis because I've I've thoroughly enjoyed this. [00:39:04] S4: Well, that's very kind of you. Thank you very much, Ross. I think what people who listen to this podcast or watch panels fail to appreciate is actually really quite hard to host. So I very much appreciate your kind words. Benjamin, how about you? Any final wishes?
00:39:04 · Sarah Kocianski, Benjamin Ensor
[00:39:04] S4: Well, that's very kind of you. Thank you very much, Ross. I think what people who listen to this podcast or watch panels fail to appreciate is actually really quite hard to host. So I very much appreciate your kind words. Benjamin, how about you? Any final wishes? [00:39:19] S6: Well, this is gonna be quite a nerdy one, but I've had a number of people in on the B2B side of financial services just saying, god. I wish ISO 20,022 was universally adopted, which I know is one for kind of finding of the geeks, but something like that would actually make quite a big difference to an awful lot of companies and save an awful lot of time. So better adoption of API standards and data standards would save an awful lot of people an awful lot of work. So it's boring plumbing, but important. [00:39:48] S4: Well, thank you very much all of you for being such gracious guests. I think we've given the Fintech Fairy godmother quite a lot of work to do. Thankfully, it will not be me next time around. We've talked about changing the incentives behind banking, making money easier to talk about, using technology to tackle long standing problems, and rethinking some of the rules of financial services. Before I hang out my magic wand, I have one final question for all three of you. If we came back to these three wishes at episode 1,200, which one do you think would actually be closest to achieving?