Peter Lohmann's Podcast
00:51:16 · Peter Lohmann, Adam Willis
[00:51:16] S1: Yeah. [00:51:16] S0: Awful person. They're actually can be really reasonable, but they... When they get so... Human nature, when people attack here and get really aggressive, you have no other choice but to become defensive. If you're really mature, you can get really curious. Right? And, like, if we can get away from, like, us constantly being so defensive and always feel like we're under attack and just saying, I just wanna get curious with you, mister resident. Hey, homeowner. I just wanna get curious. Like, what's the real issue for you? And you can actually connect on a human level. So everyone who's avoiding this, you're actually probably making it worse. Oh, 100%. [00:51:53] S1: Yeah. [00:51:53] S0: We were in... We went to court. So case in point, we were in small claims court two weeks ago, three weeks ago. I showed up. I had two other directors there. So this meeting is easily $600 an hour for us. We went pro se. Tenant shows up. Wait. How does he [00:52:07] S1: do pro se? [00:52:09] S0: We don't have to. Our our attorneys are like... When we show up to small claims court and we come out and we have to teach these judges who are attorneys that are just doing some volunteer work, When we show up, it looks really bad. You're the big bad landlord. So a lot of times, we'll go just sell low. And this is, like [00:52:28] S1: not a property... This is for a property you don't own, though? [00:52:31] S0: No. We represent the homeowners in court. [00:52:33] S1: I don't think that's allowed, my boy. [00:52:35] S0: No. We do it all the time.
00:52:35 · Adam Willis, Peter Lohmann
[00:52:35] S0: No. We do it all the time. [00:52:37] S1: That's crazy. You're you're, like, practicing law. [00:52:40] S0: Well, they're suing us. [00:52:42] S1: Yeah. But you're you're just an you're just a you're just an agent on behalf of your principal. [00:52:47] S0: That's a great perspective. I would love to not go to court, or I would love to not go to court on behalf of my clients. But we've been doing it for forty plus years. I think most property management companies in the state of Utah are doing it that way as well. [00:53:00] S1: I bet you're right. And I can see why that is effective for the reason you articulated. Definitely not allowed in Ohio. And I haven't been in a courtroom for this business in six or eight years. [00:53:12] S0: That's fantastic, Peter. Like, we... I need to reflect on that and be like, hey, you know what? We can't represent you in court. Here's an attorney. You gotta pay them [00:53:20] S1: Oh, yeah. [00:53:20] S0: $400 an hour, 650 an hour Yes. To represent. And I think they might be a lot more willing to settle. I'm thinking out loud here. I know we're supposed to like, I'm an expert in this too. No. No. We're all [00:53:31] S1: figuring it out.
00:53:31 · Peter Lohmann, Adam Willis
[00:53:31] S1: figuring it out. [00:53:32] S0: I'm faking it. Like, underneath this composure, I'm just frantically trying to stay above water. Yeah. So so we we... Sorry. We went to court the other day. The tenant who had a security deposit dispute, we made, like, a $1,500 claim against a security deposit that was, like, $3,000. He was pissed, filed a claim, did a ChatGPT empowered him. He filed the suit. We show up. He goes, can I just read this, your honor? And he read a ChatGPT script. The judge turns to us and, like, anything you you wanna add besides what you had already submitted to the court? And we just said, yep. You know, the law says this. The law says this. And in three sentences, she stopped and she goes, sorry, mister Tenet. I have to rule with these guys. You've completely wasted the court's time. I don't know where you're getting these facts. And just... She was very nice, but also really embarrassed this guy. And I'm like, what a waste of the court's time. And that's... I like... And and I can't go get... I can't go back to my homeowner and be like, hey. We won in court, and you owe us $750. I I guess I could, and I probably should. Absolutely. I should not be going to court. Yeah. [00:54:37] S1: That's one the things I...... In your PMA about, like, court hourly rate for court representations and all that? [00:54:42] S0: You know, we do. And and that's outside of the scope of normal property management, but we've just not done a very good job at implementing clauses or or standing behind the clauses in our PMA. [00:54:55] S1: Yeah, man.
00:54:55 · Peter Lohmann, Adam Willis
[00:54:55] S1: Yeah, man. [00:54:56] S0: Thank you for helping me realize this on a podcast that hopefully 20,000 people will listen to. [00:55:02] S1: Yeah. Hopefully, you're right. Alright. So, yeah, AI... I had something I was gonna add there. [00:55:07] S0: AI is amazing. It's also very dangerous. [00:55:10] S1: Yeah. I don't know where this is all gonna go because this is happening across every industry. And especially when tenants don't have any legal fees that they're out of pocket, there's no incentive for them to do anything except file, file, file. Whereas for us, we're out... You know, we're... It costs us money or time or both even if we win. So it seems like it's an exploitation or it's like a weakness in the legal system that's being exploited now, and AI is kinda turbocharging that. So that's tough. Okay. Let's see. What else do we wanna get into here? You mentioned wanting to ask me some questions. We got six, eight minutes left. What are you curious about? Happy to see, you know, turn the tables.
00:55:10 · Peter Lohmann, Adam Willis
[00:55:10] S1: Yeah. I don't know where this is all gonna go because this is happening across every industry. And especially when tenants don't have any legal fees that they're out of pocket, there's no incentive for them to do anything except file, file, file. Whereas for us, we're out... You know, we're... It costs us money or time or both even if we win. So it seems like it's an exploitation or it's like a weakness in the legal system that's being exploited now, and AI is kinda turbocharging that. So that's tough. Okay. Let's see. What else do we wanna get into here? You mentioned wanting to ask me some questions. We got six, eight minutes left. What are you curious about? Happy to see, you know, turn the tables. [00:55:52] S0: I mean, I think that's only fair. You're you're such... You're so good at interviewing other people. I'm like, let's pull back the curtain on Peter and, like, where his mind's at. And so you you obviously have a pretty great SOI and a pretty breadth of knowledge and and fortunate enough to connect with so many, you know, different people that I'm like, hey. I wonder what Peter has to say about this. And you're pretty good about vocalizing your your your opinions and scattering it through all these people that you're interviewing. But, like like, what are you working on? Like, obviously, podcast and the Peter Lohmann show, we all love and adore it. Tell tell me what what the pro... Where this is going, where you see it going.
00:56:29 · Peter Lohmann
[00:56:29] S1: Yeah. The media business has kinda turned into a going concern sneakily. Started with just the podcast and shortly thereafter, the newsletter. Both of those started mostly just for fun. Then discovered I was able to sell sponsorships, and now I've ramped up the podcast. It's now a year round show, and we have video, and the newsletter has now gone twice a week. And I'm scattering in these various reports and surveys and things that I'm putting out, like the top 40 largest property management companies, And I just love it. It's it's... Some of my favorite work that I do is using the platform that I've got to move the industry forward and help operators. The the filter that I use for everything that I publish is, would this help a property management business owner to know this, to learn this, to see this, to hear this? If the answer is no, then, generally, I won't publish it because either not relevant or it's essentially gossip. And so now sometimes things are kinda like right on that line where it's like, you know, AppFolio is involved with such and such a lawsuit. Does it help the average property manager know that? I I think so. There's maybe an argument to be made that it's kinda like not relevant or I'm just trying to get views or whatever. But I do think it... You know, it's important that people know what's happening in the industry with some of the larger players. And there was no one really doing that work. Like, no one is... Has, like, court reporter with keywords getting notified and, like, you know, I've been able to break some stories, which has been extremely professionally rewarding and help property managers know what's going on. So, yeah, it's really fun, and I love doing it. I'm glad that I've gotten the management company to the point where I actually have time to do this stuff because it requires a lot of research and writing. And AI is, of course, helping a lot with that. I've also been bringing in reporters to help. I am actually... I sent a reporter to broker owner in the spring. I'm sending another reporter to Zillow's conference coming up here in the fall. They have a... Something called Zillow Rentals Unlocked that is a pretty new event, but it's, like, two or three days, I think, in Scottsdale. I... I'm not able to go, but I'm sending a reporter.