Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth
01:19:03 · Jen Abel, Lenny Rachitsky
[01:19:03] S1: [inaudible 01:19:03] how to buy. So they know how to buy. They're so used to it. Consultants, lawyers, you name it. There's always budget for services. [01:19:16] S0: Yeah. We talked about this last time, so we won't get too deep into it. Something else I wanted to ask you at the end here, say you're a buyer and say you're talking to Jen and you're just not sure this is a fit, you don't want to disappoint, you don't want to drag you along. What are some things that people buying software products, working with a salesperson, how should they communicate? What should they be saying to avoid disappointment? [01:19:41] S1: Yeah, I would say, as soon as humanly possible, explain why the timing's not right. It usually comes down to timing or why they're not mature enough to be able to be in a position to ... It's interesting. Your organization and the team has to be structured in a way to bring on the technology. There's a maturity you have to go through. I know we talked about this before where sometimes it's easier to sell the service first and then do the technology and counsel them towards the technology. But if your sales maturity in the enterprise is further down the road, you want to start with selling the technology versus the services. [01:20:20] S0: And if you talk about how it's not the right timing or not mature, I imagine the salesperson will try to prod you and push you to see if maybe you're not ... So it's okay to just tell them what you think, "It's not the right time."
01:20:20 · Lenny Rachitsky, Jen Abel
[01:20:20] S0: And if you talk about how it's not the right timing or not mature, I imagine the salesperson will try to prod you and push you to see if maybe you're not ... So it's okay to just tell them what you think, "It's not the right time." [01:20:32] S1: But you know what you can get. I've had clients say to me, "Hey, I don't know if we're in a position to do this," and I've straight up said to them, "You are a liability not closing this gap." And sometimes they just need to be like ... Again, you need to know if you're in a position to be able to say that, "But listen, I know you need this. I know you need this. I'm not accepting no as an answer. How do we figure this out together?" Because again, use the intel they've given you towards that. [01:21:03] S0: And interestingly, you're talking to a lot of their competitors and you would think you have insight into, "Okay, here's what everyone else is doing in this space."
01:21:03 · Lenny Rachitsky, Jen Abel
[01:21:03] S0: And interestingly, you're talking to a lot of their competitors and you would think you have insight into, "Okay, here's what everyone else is doing in this space." [01:21:11] S1: No, exactly, or like, "Hey, listen, on our first two calls, you told me how important this is. Did that change?" "No, we're just in a weird spot." I'd be like, "Okay, listen, here's what we're going to do. Let's start it a little bit smaller. Let's get in. You admitted that this is something that you guys need. I know that we are going to crush it for you. I don't want X to get in the way of that. "And then obviously, there's going to be the cases where it's like, "It's just not the right time." They might be going through an acquisition and bringing on net-new vendors is just not a priority right now and you just have to respect that too. [01:21:54] S0: I love how this whole process, a lot of listeners of these podcasts are product managers, product people, it just feels very product-y and product manager-y in terms of the organization and the step by step and just staying on top of all these little things. It's so interesting how you don't think sales and product management are at all alike, but they're so similar and it's just like you being human, the way a PM tries to understand what your pain points are, "We're here to solve them." Yeah, unexpected. We did it, Jen. We did it. We're going through it all. Is there anything else? Anything else we haven't touched on? Anything else you want to, I don't know, leave listeners with before we wrap up? [01:22:33] S1: We gave them a lot.
01:22:33 · Jen Abel, Lenny Rachitsky
[01:22:33] S1: We gave them a lot. [01:22:34] S0: We did, which was the goal, Just the right amount. I'm excited for ... Oh, I was going to say, I love that AI ... I don't think it came up maybe one time in this conversation. Very rare these days in podcasts, which I love. [01:22:49] S1: Well, it's interesting. So many people will create AI reports that they can send to their clients or AI imagery or, I don't know, you name your flavor. And it's like anyone can do that. It just feels salesy. [01:23:11] S0: "What's your alpha?" [01:23:11] S1: Exactly. [01:23:11] S0: They always come back to that. [01:23:11] S1: Exactly. [01:23:12] S0: And I know you talked about this last time like, "Just craft your own email and text. Don't use the boilerplate, don't use your AI." [01:23:21] S1: Those living and breathing, I swear to God that people can read you saying the email out loud. [01:23:28] S0: Yeah. Okay, Jen. [01:23:33] S1: This was awesome. [01:23:33] S0: This was amazing. Everything I want it to be. This is going to be ... I'm excited for the, not to talk about AI, but just AI summary of this, especially that's just going to be like, "Step one, two, three, four." [01:23:42] S1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:23:44] S0: Final questions. Anything you want to plug? Anywhere you want to point people to? And how can listeners be useful to you? [01:23:51] S1: Let me know if anyone has questions. I'm more than happy to go deeper into this. I would say, here's a plug. If anyone is interested in enterprise sales, we are actively hiring and I will teach you everything I know.
01:23:51 · Jen Abel, Lenny Rachitsky
[01:23:51] S1: Let me know if anyone has questions. I'm more than happy to go deeper into this. I would say, here's a plug. If anyone is interested in enterprise sales, we are actively hiring and I will teach you everything I know. [01:24:07] S0: Wow. And this is at State Affairs. [01:24:08] S1: This is at State Affairs. [01:24:10] S0: Holy shit. What an opportunity. So there's multiple roles, not just one. [01:24:14] S1: Multiple roles. Yeah. [01:24:15] S0: Wow. You'll be paid to learn from Jen directly. [01:24:18] S1: Yes, I will teach you everything I know. [01:24:21] S0: Whoa. Okay, cool. We'll link to the job descriptions in the description if you want to check that out. [01:24:27] S1: Awesome. [01:24:27] S0: Amazing. Jen, thank you so much for being here. [01:24:29] S1: Lenny, this was awesome. [01:24:31] S0: So awesome. Bye, everyone. Thank you so much for listening. If you found this valuable, you can subscribe to the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or your favorite podcast app. Also, please consider giving us a rating or leaving a review as that really helps other listeners find the podcast. You can find all past episodes or learn more about the show at lennyspodcast.com. See you in the next episode.