A Product Market Fit Show | Startup Podcast for Founders
00:03:38 · Pablo Srugo, Mark
[00:03:38] S0: Take us back to those early days, pre-Second Closet. What's going on? Are you in this mindset of like, you want to start a business and you're looking for the thing, or how do you even come up with that first idea? [00:03:49] S1: It was a very much go-with-the-flow moment in time. My co-founder, Heindrik, and I both had full-time jobs lined up. I was supposed to be a management consultant. He was supposed to be a product manager at a large health tech company. We were just doing Second Closet as a side hustle to make more money on the side. The problem was that with $500 invested into guerrilla marketing, and by guerrilla marketing, I mean we used U of T printing credits, which were free, VistaPrint business cards, which are super, I don't even know how they make money, it's super inexpensive, and some really targeted Facebook ads geographically confined to campus, so $500 in total. We generated 20k of monthly recurring revenue in two weeks. We said, holy shit. [00:04:32] S0: How cheap were those Facebook ads? Each one is supposed to be at least $2, $3 to get an actual event. No?
00:04:32 · Pablo Srugo, Mark
[00:04:32] S0: How cheap were those Facebook ads? Each one is supposed to be at least $2, $3 to get an actual event. No? [00:04:38] S1: Well, let's keep in mind this was back in 2017 when the times were good. Before any kinda iOS changes. We probably had the benefit of some of that tailwind. We had the benefit of being able to target just university students, just in these postal codes. Our frequency of someone seeing our ads was super high. It built a lot of trust in the brand that they've never heard of before. Then seeing our flyers inside of bathroom stalls and in front of urinals, I don't know if that added or detracted, probably how the hell did these things get in here, but in any event, people had high frequency in their dorm buildings and then we slipped the business cards under people's dorm room doors when we broke into all the buildings somewhat illegally, but we were technically students, so it was okay. All that to say, we had a very targeted campaign with very cheeky messaging because our audience were students. We said, "Hey, summer storage made sexy, use code wrap it up for $10 off bubble wrap," knowing full well that no one actually even would redeem that code because they don't really need to use bubble wrap. Just cheeky messaging like that caught their attention, and then they went to our site and ended up booking a ton of orders. It was a bit of a crazy moment for us when the orders started to roll in because they were fast and furious.
00:04:38 · Mark, Pablo Srugo
[00:04:38] S1: Well, let's keep in mind this was back in 2017 when the times were good. Before any kinda iOS changes. We probably had the benefit of some of that tailwind. We had the benefit of being able to target just university students, just in these postal codes. Our frequency of someone seeing our ads was super high. It built a lot of trust in the brand that they've never heard of before. Then seeing our flyers inside of bathroom stalls and in front of urinals, I don't know if that added or detracted, probably how the hell did these things get in here, but in any event, people had high frequency in their dorm buildings and then we slipped the business cards under people's dorm room doors when we broke into all the buildings somewhat illegally, but we were technically students, so it was okay. All that to say, we had a very targeted campaign with very cheeky messaging because our audience were students. We said, "Hey, summer storage made sexy, use code wrap it up for $10 off bubble wrap," knowing full well that no one actually even would redeem that code because they don't really need to use bubble wrap. Just cheeky messaging like that caught their attention, and then they went to our site and ended up booking a ton of orders. It was a bit of a crazy moment for us when the orders started to roll in because they were fast and furious. [00:05:51] S0: What even led you, this is when it was already kind of a side hustle and this was your growth hack, let's say, but how did you come up with the idea of helping people store stuff for the summer?
00:05:51 · Pablo Srugo, Mark
[00:05:51] S0: What even led you, this is when it was already kind of a side hustle and this was your growth hack, let's say, but how did you come up with the idea of helping people store stuff for the summer? [00:06:02] S1: Yeah, I think my mentality in general is obstacle, solution, obstacle, solution. In this case, the seed was planted when I had moved out of our family home as a 17-year-old with my brother and we moved into a tiny condo in Liberty Village. Really only started working on the idea much later in 2016, built a website with a team overseas that was super inexpensive, launched with that website, and some tweaks thereof. It was a personal experience that drove it. The ultimate application of what it was, the beachhead market was a lot different. It was just a good moment in time to revisit the business and push it out. We did that and saw that really early success, and shortly after that big push, we raised the 500k seed round a day before I was supposed to start full-time on June 1st and rescinded our offers with two weeks' notice technically, but in advance of starting, and I've never looked back. [00:07:01] S0: I'm curious. We will jump into that in a second but you talk about this obstacle, solution, obstacle, solution, which I think is a pretty common frame of mind amongst founders. That's what makes them builders. Was this your first business, or was this the first one that worked? I'm curious if you had a bunch of other attempts prior to that.
00:07:01 · Pablo Srugo, Mark
[00:07:01] S0: I'm curious. We will jump into that in a second but you talk about this obstacle, solution, obstacle, solution, which I think is a pretty common frame of mind amongst founders. That's what makes them builders. Was this your first business, or was this the first one that worked? I'm curious if you had a bunch of other attempts prior to that. [00:07:19] S1: I had an e-commerce brand that was a watch company. I had built a prototype, kickstarted it, built another model, kickstarted it. Always aiming, as a broke student, use as little as possible upfront to then build into something great. That's where Kickstarter was awesome for product-based businesses. A $300 prototype ended up garnering a 250k-a-year business for me that helped me pay my way through school, and build a small stock portfolio that would help me pay for some of my living expenses with dividends. That was the business before. It wasn't a smashing success. I probably should have raised money for that business because, at the time, Facebook ads were even cheaper. This was like 2014, 2015. Then on top of that, a competitor was just starting out called MVMT, which ended up getting sold to Movado for $100 million a handful of years later. That was the first brush with business, of starting something from scratch as a product-based business based online. This was a service-based business based online so a lot of the marketing knowledge was helpful, but running a service business, totally different than a product business.
00:07:19 · Mark, Pablo Srugo
[00:07:19] S1: I had an e-commerce brand that was a watch company. I had built a prototype, kickstarted it, built another model, kickstarted it. Always aiming, as a broke student, use as little as possible upfront to then build into something great. That's where Kickstarter was awesome for product-based businesses. A $300 prototype ended up garnering a 250k-a-year business for me that helped me pay my way through school, and build a small stock portfolio that would help me pay for some of my living expenses with dividends. That was the business before. It wasn't a smashing success. I probably should have raised money for that business because, at the time, Facebook ads were even cheaper. This was like 2014, 2015. Then on top of that, a competitor was just starting out called MVMT, which ended up getting sold to Movado for $100 million a handful of years later. That was the first brush with business, of starting something from scratch as a product-based business based online. This was a service-based business based online so a lot of the marketing knowledge was helpful, but running a service business, totally different than a product business. [00:08:32] S0: How did that early fundraising go? Was that from VCs, angels? Did you already have kind of a network at that point?