A Product Market Fit Show | Startup Podcast for Founders
00:08:51 · Niklas Lindgren, Pablo Srugo
[00:08:51] S0: So we both were in law school, thought that was a bit boring. Started a company almost as a side hustle that ended up that we scaled that company. That was a design build integrator and contractor for security systems. So we were part of building enterprise level security systems for data centers and logistics like, warehouses and enterprise office campuses around the world. But this started very small in Stockholm. We started doing small system installs of CCTV cameras to iPhone repair shops, but we ended up building very, very large enterprise systems. [00:09:27] S2: But this is what? You bought off the shelf stuff, you just figured out enough to make it happen, or did you or Anton have a little background here? [00:09:33] S0: So there's a long story of this, which I won't give you all to. Because then we'll sit here for a very long time, but Anton lived in China before, and so he got connected to some people in Beijing that were connected to a CCTV manufacturer called Dahua. Which at the time was completely unknown in the northern region or in Europe overall and we were the first integrator or distributor of that in the Nordic region. And now it's almost a market standard in northern Europe. But at the time, no one knew about us. We got the opportunity to first work as a distributor and then we started to install ourselves. And then we grew that business over the course of eight years into a substantial size alternative to companies like Securitas or Convergint.
00:09:33 · Niklas Lindgren, Pablo Srugo
[00:09:33] S0: So there's a long story of this, which I won't give you all to. Because then we'll sit here for a very long time, but Anton lived in China before, and so he got connected to some people in Beijing that were connected to a CCTV manufacturer called Dahua. Which at the time was completely unknown in the northern region or in Europe overall and we were the first integrator or distributor of that in the Nordic region. And now it's almost a market standard in northern Europe. But at the time, no one knew about us. We got the opportunity to first work as a distributor and then we started to install ourselves. And then we grew that business over the course of eight years into a substantial size alternative to companies like Securitas or Convergint. [00:10:21] S2: How big did this business get? Like revenue or employee wise, whatever you can share? [00:10:24] S0: So we were around $15, $20 million in revenue and then we sold it to a private equity firm. [00:10:32] S2: Gotcha. [00:10:32] S0: In 2022, so we did our first exit when we were 26 or something. [00:10:37] S2: It's an interesting one, because it's not like, obviously it's not venture massive whatever. But you bootstrapped it, you know, you put a multiple on that twenty and you divide by two, and it's a massive payday.
00:10:37 · Pablo Srugo, Niklas Lindgren
[00:10:37] S2: It's an interesting one, because it's not like, obviously it's not venture massive whatever. But you bootstrapped it, you know, you put a multiple on that twenty and you divide by two, and it's a massive payday. [00:10:46] S0: Yeah, exactly. That was sort of my business school years that I never got. But it was really good. I'm very glad that we bootstrapped it and that we got really good understanding of how money flows. How to build an organization from first principles and I think many people that are starting companies in the VC space early on. Don't really understand what a million dollars or two million dollars actually are, and then we got to learn that the hard way. We almost got bankrupt so many times. We put in all our personal savings and took on an incredible amount of risk early on in our lives. If I could re deal with some of the decisions, I probably would have done. But the outcome was great. [00:11:34] S2: And what happens after? You sell it in 2022, do you stay there for a bit? Because you didn't start Endra until end of 2024 or early 2025. [00:11:41] S0: Exactly, so we stayed there until end of '24. So the segue into Endra is that we had a big design team in this venture that was building all of our designs for ourselves in Endra. So once we were installing a security system, we needed a design team that built the drawings for this and the schematics, and all the calculations behind it. [00:12:01] S2: Same way as you would need for the other stuff, like the HVAC system, the plumbing, et cetera.
00:12:01 · Pablo Srugo, Niklas Lindgren
[00:12:01] S2: Same way as you would need for the other stuff, like the HVAC system, the plumbing, et cetera. [00:12:06] S0: Exactly, it's just different systems, right? [00:12:07] S2: OK. [00:12:08] S0: So my dad is an architect and he said like, if you guys want to have a proper impact on how these buildings are designed in this world. You shouldn't focus too much on security systems, you should focus on the large stuff that are being installed in the core of all buildings. So we did and that was sort of how we found our way into this world. [00:12:06] S2: And you started this with Anton as well? Same co-founder?
00:12:06 · Pablo Srugo, Niklas Lindgren
[00:12:06] S2: And you started this with Anton as well? Same co-founder? [00:12:06] S0: Yeah, so I started with Anton that I started my first business with, and then I had a friend from ten years back whose name was Gustav. And Gustav at the time was working at Goldman Sachs in Stockholm. He was part of a startup that got acquired by Goldman. So he was at Goldman building autonomous trading systems as a developer or engineer. So I called him, he was one of the smartest guys that I knew and I said, we think we have something here. We showed him the actual workflows of how you, like, what are the state of the art in how you design and engineer technical systems to buildings? How does these processes work? And he was blown away. He asked us questions like, how did the global engineering community and the global engineering industry accept this as standard? Why haven't someone done anything about this before? And those were sort of the right questions, because those were the questions that we had as well. So we almost verified our thesis a little bit. But he said, I will join as a co founder but I have one requirement and that requirement is that I can bring on a fourth co founder. His name is David, and my other requirement is that he's becoming CTO. So we got connected with David. We had never met David before, but he had been working with Gustav in Goldman Sachs for many years. [00:13:50] S2: And when is this, by the way? Timeline wise? [00:13:52] S0: Timeline wise, this is summer of '24.
00:13:52 · Niklas Lindgren, Pablo Srugo
[00:13:52] S0: Timeline wise, this is summer of '24. [00:13:57] S2: So you're still working at the other business. You're starting to think about this at the same time.