02:28:34 路 Jordi Hays, John Coogan, Trent Simonian, Markie Wagner, Sridhar Ramaswamy
[02:28:34] S0: What if forks were spoons? [02:28:35] S1: What if forks were spoons? [02:28:36] S12: Go to [02:28:36] S0: cutlery.ai. [02:28:37] S1: What's people been asking that question recently? Anyway, very fun. Let me tell you about Cisco. Where is Cisco? Cisco. Critical infrastructure for the AI era. Unlock seamless real time experiences and new value with Cisco. Our next guest is Markie Wagner from Poetic. She's the founder and CEO [02:28:57] S0: Future hall of [02:28:58] S1: prolific mafia player. What's your favorite role in mafia? [02:29:04] S7: Oh, mafia. I think who doesn't love to be fascist in Mafia? I you know, you always gotta hope you're getting the fascist card but Who is the fascist I in [02:29:13] S1: thought it was just Mafia Townsperson Oh, [02:29:15] S7: I'm the secret head larc. [02:29:17] S1: You're secret head larc. [02:29:18] S8: Yes. Yes. [02:29:21] S7: Yeah. I mean, mafia is always one of mafia. Yeah. You want single time. [02:29:24] S1: It's always power. It's it's less empowering to be the townsperson because you feel like you're just getting killed. You have no superpowers. But running angel or sheriff, that can be fun. But then if you get killed off early, it's the end. I'm just thinking of it because the the latest episode of Mafia episode two from Founders Fund dropped and you're backed by Founders Fund. But since this is your first time on the show, why don't you introduce yourself? Tell us how you wound up in a position to raise money from Founders Fund.
02:29:24 路 John Coogan, Markie Wagner
[02:29:24] S1: It's always power. It's it's less empowering to be the townsperson because you feel like you're just getting killed. You have no superpowers. But running angel or sheriff, that can be fun. But then if you get killed off early, it's the end. I'm just thinking of it because the the latest episode of Mafia episode two from Founders Fund dropped and you're backed by Founders Fund. But since this is your first time on the show, why don't you introduce yourself? Tell us how you wound up in a position to raise money from Founders Fund. [02:29:50] S7: Cool. Yeah. So I'm the CEO of and wait. I think I'm okay. Yeah. So I'm the CEO and founder of Poetic. Yeah. And Poetic's an AI system that will learn and execute super complicated processes Mhmm. In some of the biggest companies in the world at over 99% accuracy which is Okay. Which is quite hard. [02:30:09] S1: Yeah. So what is the process for obtaining and documenting the workflow? This feels like you could do something very database driven. You could build an ontology. You could just wait and maybe the models get better and stop hallucinating. There's been debates over the various approaches like what did you pick and why?
02:30:09 路 John Coogan, Jordi Hays, Jeremy Strong
[02:30:09] S1: Yeah. So what is the process for obtaining and documenting the workflow? This feels like you could do something very database driven. You could build an ontology. You could just wait and maybe the models get better and stop hallucinating. There's been debates over the various approaches like what did you pick and why? [02:30:29] S0: Wait, before we get into that, like, talk more about the kinds of workflows Yeah. Where act like, you know, we we caught up a few weeks ago and and you were saying like, some of the customers that you're talking to, even if even if somebody came through and they were like, our AI system is 98.5% accurate, that that would actually create, you know, hundreds or thousands of hours of like issues in an organization. And it would actually like rolling that kind of system out would have sort of like negative enterprise value. [02:31:02] S1: That's just a pitch problem. If you're pitching a software like that, you just gotta tell someone, our system has 9,000 basis points of accuracy. Yeah. Is the goal. [02:31:12] S0: Put it in basis points. [02:31:13] S4: Put it in [02:31:13] S1: basis points also. [02:31:14] S0: Anyways, talk talk more about the problem before we talk about the solution.
02:31:14 路 Jordi Hays, Markie Wagner, S3, John Coogan
[02:31:14] S0: Anyways, talk talk more about the problem before we talk about the solution. [02:31:18] S7: Yeah. So I think the problem is, you know, one of things you've seen is, you know, obviously AI is incredible at writing code Mhmm. And it has really crushed that. But, you know, a lot of the main processes that are at the heart of these giant businesses have remained pretty untouched by AI. Mhmm. And the reason why is that the rules that govern them, you know, the 10,000 secret rules, they live in people's heads. [02:31:41] S3: Mhmm. [02:31:42] S7: Right? And these rules need to be followed every single time. You know, we work on things like anti money laundering and underwriting and fraud investigations where every single step matters. And to actually get from where we are now to those running on machines, you need two things. One is a system that can learn the process. Not the 100 pages of written down stuff, but the 10,000 rules that live in people's head that they've never written down before. So that's part one. And then you have to be able to run them with many nines of accuracy. Not, you know I was talking with one CEO, he's like, know, 80% on an eval is great, but in underwriting, it's unusable. [02:32:20] S1: Mhmm.
02:32:20 路 John Coogan, Markie Wagner
[02:32:20] S1: Mhmm. [02:32:20] S7: And I think that's the u for a lot of these biz processes that are at the heart of these, like, really big and old businesses. So you gotta do two things. You got a system that can learn all the rules and then run them with nines. And if you have that, you can get from where we are now to this version of the future that I think everybody's really excited about, but you need to build that bridge. [02:32:38] S1: Mhmm. Not everyone's excited about it. AI has very low approval rate, But tech leaders are certainly excited about it. But so why have you started with such big companies? Like, I feel like you've been you've been, you know, at the heart of the startup ecosystem for so long. If you came on here and said, oh, we have so many, you know, my friends' companies on board. These are the named customers SoFi, Chime, AIG, like these are large institutions at this point. Why start at the top? Feels harder.
02:32:38 路 John Coogan, Markie Wagner
[02:32:38] S1: Mhmm. Not everyone's excited about it. AI has very low approval rate, But tech leaders are certainly excited about it. But so why have you started with such big companies? Like, I feel like you've been you've been, you know, at the heart of the startup ecosystem for so long. If you came on here and said, oh, we have so many, you know, my friends' companies on board. These are the named customers SoFi, Chime, AIG, like these are large institutions at this point. Why start at the top? Feels harder. [02:33:15] S7: Yeah. I think our view was when you're building something like this, if you build something that's less powerful, it's hard to sometimes make it more powerful. Mhmm. Like, lot of these drag and drop tools, they were simpler, they were easier, they could do simpler things faster, but they just couldn't handle super complex things. Mhmm. And so, you kind of get kneecapped in terms of what you can represent and build. And the view is, hey, AI is gonna be doing a lot of this, like, writing of the software. You'd be in a better place optimizing for the power of the thing. Mhmm. Can it express and run these five hour processes require those nines and then everything else becomes really easy actually. Mhmm. And I don't think that people are going to be having a platform for the easy stuff and the hard stuff. I think they're just gonna be running all of their processes in one spot.