02:04:13 路 Jordi Hays, John Coogan, Vinod Khosla
[02:04:13] S0: Turning Joe Weisenthal's tweets into full articles. [02:04:17] S1: This is crazy because there's a there's a live show that turns his tweets into like minutes of just back and forth conversation and banter. But somebody made a version of our show that's just web pages. So they scrape every Joe Wiesenthal tweet and they turn it into a full SEO optimized art This is great. It it is great and Joe looks great in this photo. He's looking good. He's looking quizzical. He's having fun. Well, let's bring in our next guest, Vinod Khosla, the founder and managing director of Khosla Ventures. Vinod, thank you so much for taking the time. How are you doing? [02:04:55] S9: I'm doing great. Great to be here. [02:04:57] S1: Fantastic to have you. I want to kick it off with some of the recent deal making that you've been doing. Your outlook on artificial intelligence is obviously front and center. But what has been the most recent fundraise that you've done? Why did it get you excited? [02:05:14] S9: Well, obviously, there's a lot hits on yesterday or today. We are working a lot and doing a lot of new things That I'm pretty excited about is a company like Pramana. Mhmm. But more importantly, the broad category of order formalization, which isn't talked about much. But humans aren't very good at talking to AI in driving what they precisely want. And that's where auto formalization becomes important, and companies like Fana become very important.
02:05:14 路 Vinod Khosla, John Coogan
[02:05:14] S9: Well, obviously, there's a lot hits on yesterday or today. We are working a lot and doing a lot of new things That I'm pretty excited about is a company like Pramana. Mhmm. But more importantly, the broad category of order formalization, which isn't talked about much. But humans aren't very good at talking to AI in driving what they precisely want. And that's where auto formalization becomes important, and companies like Fana become very important. [02:05:55] S1: How did you get into auto formalization? And I guess the big better question is, as an investor, you have to consider, is auto formalization on the direct path for the other labs? How do you think about competition in this area? Investors are going back and forth, and it's been fascinating to see things that appear to be directly in the path of the big labs. They're still growing revenues 2,000,000,003 billion $4,000,000,000 We're seeing $60,000,000,000 acquisitions. Everything seems to be going well up and down the stack. But why is there a particularly big opportunity right now? [02:06:34] S9: Well, the labs, they will do more and more over time, but I still see the opposite being very broad for venture capital and fund nodes. In terms of nodes are coming up with great ideas. [02:06:52] S1: Mhmm.
02:06:52 路 John Coogan, Vinod Khosla
[02:06:52] S1: Mhmm. [02:06:52] S9: One of example looks at the tag board and says it's not very precise because it's written by humans. You can make it into a machine checkable language. Mhmm. Mathematicians turn all their problems in this specific language. It is hard for humans to understand. Auto formalization allows that kind of formalization so computers can operate on it precisely, not problemistically. And that's a really important thing. Mhmm. If you look at today's world, AI systems have been awesome and the rate of capability development would be awesome. But they have some pretty big gaping holes. They still hallucinate. I don't think hallucination is going away anytime soon. Yeah. So the reliability is low. Humans aren't great at specifying what they want, the specification problem. Mhmm. And then verification of what are you getting the right answers? Or are they hallucinate? Those are all large interesting problems which are open for entrepreneurs. Things can be built in certain domains [02:08:05] S1: Mhmm. [02:08:06] S9: Where you build a lot of value and a lot of capability that the general models don't do.
02:08:06 路 Vinod Khosla, John Coogan
[02:08:06] S9: Where you build a lot of value and a lot of capability that the general models don't do. [02:08:15] S1: How are you thinking about applications of this technology in particular? It's been so hard to predict the original GPT. No one was really expecting a knowledge retrieval service. It just sort of went viral when ChatGPT launched. Coding agents, some people had predicted those, but it was sort of an unexpected emergent capability. Do you expect that auto formalization as the next critical frontier of AI just makes all the existing applications better? Or is it actually going to unlock new applications? [02:08:52] S9: I think it will allow humans to use AI where it wasn't previously possible. Mhmm. If you want to know what your bank account is, you can't have a hallucination. If you have a medical problem, you can't have a hallucination. So auto formalization will significantly enhance existing models in domains like tax law. You know, you can have lots of tax startups, but they can't formalize. [02:09:25] S1: If you [02:09:25] S9: take tax law, it's a very specific thing. And that's an area Pramana is initially to say, can you formalize the tax code so computers can work on it precisely and not be subject to probabilistic answers or likely answers? So it's very, very important in certain domains to have precision, reliability, verification, and that's where auto formalization can significantly enhance the applications and still leverage all the power of LLabs.
02:09:25 路 Vinod Khosla, John Coogan, Jordi Hays
[02:09:25] S9: take tax law, it's a very specific thing. And that's an area Pramana is initially to say, can you formalize the tax code so computers can work on it precisely and not be subject to probabilistic answers or likely answers? So it's very, very important in certain domains to have precision, reliability, verification, and that's where auto formalization can significantly enhance the applications and still leverage all the power of LLabs. [02:10:03] S1: Mhmm. Well, we're excited to talk to the founder of Pramana in just a minute. We've been having a few technical errors, we will end this here and hopefully we can have you back on the show soon to go deeper. Thank you so much for taking the time to chat with us today, Vinod. It's been [02:10:20] S0: a Yeah. Thanks for jumping on. It's an honor. [02:10:22] S1: Have a great rest of your day. [02:10:23] S9: Great to be here. Cheers. [02:10:25] S1: Thank you. Goodbye. Let me tell you about public.com investing for those who take it seriously. Stocks, options, bonds, crypto, treasuries and more with great customer service. [02:10:37] S0: Have Unfortunate technical difficulties. I couldn't really hear anything personally. No. But fortunately, the founder Is coming on. Discussing. He's just [02:10:48] S1: a few minutes. [02:10:48] S0: Right now. So we're gonna hear it again and again. Sorry about that. [02:10:54] S1: Nikesh Arora is on the timeline. Quote tweeting, I like that he's you don't think of him as like a big poster. Obviously, 73 [02:11:02] S0: followers posters.
02:11:02 路 Jordi Hays, John Coogan
[02:11:02] S0: followers posters. [02:11:04] S1: He's successful. But he said, congratulating prime minister Narendra Modi on becoming India's longest serving elected prime minister. April of leadership earned the trust earned through the trust of 1,400,000,000 people across three democratic mandates from lifting 250,000,000 people out of poverty to making India the world's fastest growing major economy. PM Modi's tenure has been nothing short of transformational. Look forward to a continued US India partnership. Love that. Yo Gesh says, bro went from stopping global ransomware attacks at Palo Alto Networks to doing math calculations on PM Modi's calendar milestones like it's his final exam. [02:11:44] S0: Just in quotes too. It's great. And Nick actually appreciates it.