00:14:16 · Anthony Pompliano
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00:14:53 · Jan Van Eck, Anthony Pompliano
[00:14:53] S1: From the from the government spending? I mean, every time I have an opportunity, I'm like, you have to have real assets, gold and Bitcoin in your portfolio. You don't know if it'll pay off, but those times... You know, my dad started VanEck and he started the first gold fund in The United States in 1968. So I... He was a gold bug. I'm not a gold bug. You know, most of my career, gold's been going down. You know, it bottomed at $250 an ounce, which is when the Central Bank of England sold it, by the way. Good good good timing. So I am not a gold bug. It's hard to believe, but I do think this is just a structural risk. And the way I put it is, for the entirety of US history, there's been financial crises that have come from the banking system or other industries, like agriculture and then rolled up through the banking system. This is gonna be started in DC and it's... There's no... No one can bail us out. And I think the rest of the world sees this. China's holding of treasuries is down by half from its peak and they are buying almost half of all gold production this year. The private market, you hear about central banks ad nauseam. This is private Chinese investors. So the world kinda sees that we're doing this and they're like backing off. [00:16:12] S2: And when you're thinking about this in terms of gold or Bitcoin's price, you said maybe it will pay off. Do you have a probability that you would assign to either one of those?
00:16:12 · Anthony Pompliano, Jan Van Eck
[00:16:12] S2: And when you're thinking about this in terms of gold or Bitcoin's price, you said maybe it will pay off. Do you have a probability that you would assign to either one of those? [00:16:22] S1: Listen, I'm a long term bull, so I definitely think it'll be higher in ten years, significantly higher. I just I just don't know. I just can't imagine. You know, I ask people, Anthony, when is The United States not gonna honor its obligations? Some people call that a default. And then I say, it's going happen in the next ten years and literally 99% of the people say no. Then I say, what about Social Security? What's going to happen? 2032, six years from now, they're gonna cut payments to Social Security. You know, people would be very, very unhappy. And then people say, well, they'll make up the money from somewhere. I'm like, really? Are they gonna do that without causing massive inflation or or other kinds of risks? And you see how people have punishing politicians for inflation. Right? I think that's partially got Trump elected, think, the midterms. So what? We're gonna massive... We're gonna inflate our way out of our debt? It's it's there's no easy answer and it's not gonna be pretty. [00:17:20] S2: How does AI and maybe the deflationary, you know, of AI affect the government spending? Is there a world where they can keep spending but AI bails them out?
00:17:20 · Anthony Pompliano, Jan Van Eck
[00:17:20] S2: How does AI and maybe the deflationary, you know, of AI affect the government spending? Is there a world where they can keep spending but AI bails them out? [00:17:30] S1: No. I mean, they're writing checks to people, right, for health care or other... I mean, unless health care... Well, retirement, by definition, can't. And then health care, I I can't see health care costs coming down so much because there will be new technologies like GLP ones that people wanna spend money on. So... No. I mean... And people say, oh, AI is a new kind of technology. It'll... It's deflationary. I'm like, what do you think that PC was? What do you think the Internet was? Right? Amazon has cut the cost of getting goods to your home. So all technology is deflationary. There were... There was great technology in the seventies, but we had runaway inflation. So I think they're not not the same. [00:18:10] S2: Let's talk about the crypto ETFs. You guys have the Bitcoin ETF, but you also have really pushed to kind of pioneer a number of the other Altcoin ETFs. [00:18:19] S1: Yeah. [00:18:19] S2: What's kind of your analysis of that right now?
00:18:19 · Anthony Pompliano, Jan Van Eck
[00:18:19] S2: What's kind of your analysis of that right now? [00:18:24] S1: It's... We have... And we have 13 crypto ETFs in Europe. So before the US government allowed it, we got pretty aggressive. I I think the days of sort of more crypto ETFs are basically over. What we what we are pushing is active management. We have an actively managed... I know you interviewed Matt Siegel. Most advisers can't pick Avalanche versus Ethereum, or or these kinds of things. So we did some layer one blockchains, right, the foundational ones will survive, I think. And then the exchanges, I think, will survive. Now, I don't know if Hyperliquid survives or, you know, I I know the BNB token isn't a direct play, or a play on on Binance, but, the Binance ecosystem maybe. But those are the two categories, Anthony, that stick in my mind. Otherwise, go with an index or go with an actively managed fund. [00:19:18] S2: Now a lot of the promise of crypto is they're coming for you. You know, they're coming for Wall Street. They're gonna tokenize things. Hyperliquid is gonna use perps. There's all these kinda new variations. Do you see this stuff as a headwind for the ETF industry, or do you actually think the ETF industry can just embrace the new technology and figure out how to how to kind of stand on its shoulders?
00:19:38 · Jan Van Eck, Anthony Pompliano
[00:19:38] S1: I think there are a couple of leading firms right now, like, I'll I'll say Franklin, Fidelity, and others that, are really in this move towards changing the back end of Wall Street towards a twenty four seven environment. So, Franklin just announced that they offered a money market fund that Uber, can... Uber users can use, to put savings in. Well, to do the the plumbing, to offer a fund that's accurately priced over the weekend, is... You know, that's that's pushed by blockchain. That's really enabled by the people that understand blockchain. So I think it's happening. It's just happening behind the scenes. You know, I think the dream actually of most blockchain enthusiasts is you don't know that you're using it. It's just in the background, making your life easier, making it twenty four seven. I think what's interesting... The most interesting thing for the ETF industry that you asked about is sports, these sports ETFs that are coming. I don't know how you don't do that on a twenty four seven basis because the sports games are at night and on the weekend. You wanna trade this thing at 10AM? No. Of course not. You wanna trade it when, you know, USC beats Ohio State. [00:20:52] S2: No comment. [00:20:53] S1: Don't mention the name... The team. When [00:20:56] S2: you look at the twenty four seven trading, will that just lead to record inflows, record volumes, and this is like a very good thing for ETFs, or do you look at potential issues by now moving and expanding the market hours because there's still humans