01:02:11 · Michael Sindicich, Miguel Armaza
[01:02:11] S1: That's interesting. There's been a lot of advice over the years. I think one thing that Ariel told me, we were on a walk in downtown Palo Alto one day. I was super stressed. This would have been like in 2017. And he told me, he was like, Dude, relax, man. We're building travel. Like, we're selling travel management. Like, relax. It's not so, like, serious. You don't have to be so stressed out about it. Which, like, is the opposite of his personality. He's very, hard driving, aggressive, all this stuff. But to hear him say that, I think about that all the time when I get really stressed. And I think it was cool. It was like, hey, look, we're building a startup. We're building a company. We're not curing cancer. But what we are doing is we're making the lives better of people who need to book and manage travel. And it's one of the more annoying solutions in your everyday life for work with legacy platforms. And if we can make it delightful, that's a great thing for the world. And that was very helpful. I think Ilan, he generally puts our value of seriously fun. He definitely puts the fun in there. He's having a great time. He's so curious about new technologies and experiences, and he gets really excited when a user has a positive NPS comment and things like that. And I think I've learned a lot from him there around, Hey, we should be having fun building this thing. You know, it's not so serious to Ariel's advice as well. [01:03:47] S0: Favorite book or podcast that you go back to often?
01:03:47 · Miguel Armaza, Michael Sindicich
[01:03:47] S0: Favorite book or podcast that you go back to often? [01:03:57] S1: Favorite book or podcast? Let's see. I think what... I saw your books here. I think one is definitely missing. It's The Hard Thing About Hard Things. Unless you... I didn't see it here. But you're looking... I do have it here. Okay. I have a signed copy. [01:04:15] S0: Keep it... It might be somewhere else. [01:04:17] S1: But I think that's great book. And I don't know if you know, but in that book, there's a guy he talks about named Shaka, and we actually hired Shaka. And he was at our company for a while, for a couple years, and still a good mentor and friend of mine. And I just love that book. I think it's that. And Ben's other other book about culture, I think I think they're spot on. So those are kind of books that I like to go back to or [01:04:44] S0: or think about a lot. You've flown a absurd number of miles. Yeah. What's something about travel that no one speaks yet?
01:04:44 · Miguel Armaza, Michael Sindicich
[01:04:44] S0: or think about a lot. You've flown a absurd number of miles. Yeah. What's something about travel that no one speaks yet? [01:04:57] S1: I hope it's coming, but it's... To me, it's the Wi Fi. Like, you know, the the Wi Fi is... It's just horrible. I think it is coming with Starlink. Out of... We didn't talk about this, but I I am a pilot as well, so I have my VFR license. Yeah. I'm working on my IFR now. I'm actually flying myself back home from Tennessee. I'm going to Tennessee now and then flying myself back home after this trip. And and even I have Starlink on the planes that that I'm flying, little single prop mini planes. So I hope, you know, it will come to the rest of the the industry. But to me, it's it's Wi Fi is specifically the thing that's broken right now on flight experiences. [01:05:37] S0: Michael, thank you for taking the time. A lot to learn from you from just an amazing decade. Until there's a lot more to learn, You're a pilot, chess master, and a bunch of other things. Thanks for stopping by. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Thanks for tuning in. And I hope you enjoyed this great episode with Michael from Navan. If you want more interviews, please subscribe, follow, and leave a review on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your shows. It helps and means a lot. And if you have any suggestions or thoughts about the show, just drop me a line on LinkedIn. See you next time.