00:06:05 · Kirsten Korosec
[00:06:05] S1: First of all, Anthony, if they took your advice, we would have nothing to talk about on this show. So... You know? But I will say this. It... There's there's this whole idea, like, making... And and other AI tools making your life easier when it comes to personal relationships. And in many of these cases, it just seems to overcomplicate what would be, like, observing your child. But that might be hard for some people, the people who are building these products, and it doesn't necessarily relate to, like, everyone else out there in the world. And so it can just seem so incredibly disconnected when you see these quotes for for everyone else. So it just... To me, it always comes back to, like, who are they speaking to? Yeah. Are there people out there
00:06:50 · Amanda Silberling, Sean O’Kane
[00:06:50] S2: who can relate? Maybe maybe there are. Yeah. And I think that a lot of the time, other use cases we've seen people mention are, like, the Bumble CEO, Whitney Wolfe Herd, has made comments about, well, what if we had, like, AI concierge is among your dating, like, your AI dates the other person's AI. And then if the AIs have a good date together, then they introduce the people. Or in the New York Times article, Marissa Mayer mentioned like, well, what if my AI could coordinate with my husband's AI and stuff like that. And I think that it feels like people are trying to over optimize out of just having conversations with people. And I feel like I've already seen that happen in my generation where I do notice in myself that if I'm ordering takeout, it feels weird to call a place. Like, I'm just so used to like, well, obviously, you can do it online and you don't have to talk to anyone. And I feel like there's just gonna be more of these things where basic human interaction gets more and more optimized out of actually occurring. And call me old school, but I think that humans being able to talk to each other is probably a net positive for society. [00:08:09] S3: Yeah. But what's the ROI, Amanda? You know? How much how much revenue can you generate over over all of the conversations that somebody's having in meeting?
00:08:09 · Sean O’Kane, Amanda Silberling
[00:08:09] S3: Yeah. But what's the ROI, Amanda? You know? How much how much revenue can you generate over over all of the conversations that somebody's having in meeting? [00:08:16] S2: That that is the thing though, is that it's like dating is really inefficient. Like, it sucks that you have to go on a bunch of dates with different people. You might waste an evening and be like, well, that was a bust. And so you can see why people are like, well, what if you didn't have to go on dates? What if your AI could go on dates for you? But, like, there's just something not human there. And then also, you are outsourcing the decision of who you are going to date to a computer that you are trusting knows you better than yourself, which I don't think is true.
00:08:16 · Amanda Silberling, Kirsten Korosec
[00:08:16] S2: That that is the thing though, is that it's like dating is really inefficient. Like, it sucks that you have to go on a bunch of dates with different people. You might waste an evening and be like, well, that was a bust. And so you can see why people are like, well, what if you didn't have to go on dates? What if your AI could go on dates for you? But, like, there's just something not human there. And then also, you are outsourcing the decision of who you are going to date to a computer that you are trusting knows you better than yourself, which I don't think is true. [00:08:53] S1: So one thing that I think is, like, worth sort of going back to, and I sort of hinted about this earlier, which is, like, who are they talking to? Who who is their who is their audience, like, for all these, like, optimizations? You know, in your view, Amanda, it's... It sounds like I might know what they answered this. But is this, you know, a product problem? Right? It's like, you know... Or is it a messaging problem? Like, are they just talking about it in the wrong way? And, actually, there's, like, this really great value in here, and it just seems out of touch with reality and humanity. But but if they just talked about it differently, it would be better. Or is it, you know, like, actually a product problem, and to your point, that we're focusing on optimizing sort of the wrong things with AI tools? I think it's a
00:08:53 · Kirsten Korosec, Amanda Silberling
[00:08:53] S1: So one thing that I think is, like, worth sort of going back to, and I sort of hinted about this earlier, which is, like, who are they talking to? Who who is their who is their audience, like, for all these, like, optimizations? You know, in your view, Amanda, it's... It sounds like I might know what they answered this. But is this, you know, a product problem? Right? It's like, you know... Or is it a messaging problem? Like, are they just talking about it in the wrong way? And, actually, there's, like, this really great value in here, and it just seems out of touch with reality and humanity. But but if they just talked about it differently, it would be better. Or is it, you know, like, actually a product problem, and to your point, that we're focusing on optimizing sort of the wrong things with AI tools? I think it's a [00:09:39] S2: little bit of both, but I think that the marketing problem comes from when you have these high up people at these massively valuable companies in a room together, talking about the pain points in their lives. And it's like making dinner reservations, booking flights. And like, everybody does those things, but like, I'm not booking flights once a week. Like, I'm not making dinner reservations all the time. Like, yeah. I mean, obviously, people find value from things like ChatGPT and Claude. But I think the value that the average person is finding isn't necessarily, like, booking a flight for me.
00:10:17 · Anthony Ha
[00:10:17] S0: Yeah. I totally agree that, like, that, you know, it just seems like so much of their experience is, you know, maybe a little different from the average person. And, of course, like, all these things are sort of abstractions. Like, what is the average person? Mean, there... There's millions of different average people. Right? One of the things I've also been thinking about is, like, when I was... You know, because I'm incredibly old. Like, you know, there are companies like Uber that when it first launched, it was sort of targeting this kind of tech early adopter set in San Francisco. And I remember being very confident, like, this will never catch on more broadly. This is just... Like, it's for a very narrow audience of young, urban, like, millennials who have money to spare on cars, and it works specifically well in San Francisco. And so, like, for a lot of things, the tech industry has succeeded by betting that, you know, hey. Like, people have not kind of caught up with us, but we are sort of the leading edge, and then we reflect kind of what the consumer of the future looks like, the family of the future looks like. And in this case, it just seems like that bet is sort of not borne out yet. I mean, for a variety of reasons, partly because I think the society that this technology is being promoted into is very different when people are starting to say, like, I don't love the influence that this technology is having in my life. I don't love that you're pitching this as something where all... Like, every experience is my life that I should be optimized out of, but, actually, I want to live my own life. I actually want to parent my own children.