Relentless
00:12:19 · Brian Armstrong, Ty Morse
Well, what do you think about this option? You know? Do you want to work with that person? You know? And I'd be like, oh, you know, I have this concern and that. Like, he'd walk me to the right answer without making it in his idea. [00:12:30] S1: I think a lot of people don't spend enough time thinking about how... Like, if you are trying to communicate, really what you're trying to do is, like, translate an idea in your head into someone else's head. Mhmm. And a lot of people will just say, you know, fit the world to me, and here's my idea, and you just share it in exactly the way that you want. Instead of actually thinking like, who is the person that I'm communicating with and how will they best interpret this idea? How do you think about basically trying to help people understand the meaning behind the thing that you're doing?
00:12:56 · Brian Armstrong, Ty Morse
[00:12:56] S0: Yeah. Well, you're right. Every time... Like, the level one communication style is to, I have a thing in my head. I will tell you about it. The level two communication style is to say, who am I speaking to? What's in it for them? What do they want? What are their interests? And tailor what you're saying to their interests. So it sounds trite, but it's true. You kind of really have to read that person or understand them enough to know what they want and then really frame it... Start with framing it in terms of what they want. The other trick, it sounds simple, but most people don't do it. Instead of going into a conversation and just launching into, here's all the things I want to install in your head, you literally have to start by asking them. And they will give you the answers to the test oftentimes. Like if you're interviewing a candidate and you can say, What's the most important thing to you in the next three to five years of your career? And they'll say, Well, it's really X and Y and Z. And then it's like, Okay, well, if we have those things, I'm going to tailor my pitch to you now. And it's the same thing in sales. If you go into a meeting with a partner, don't go in there and berate them or just talk at them, spend the first few minutes understanding what they want, then respond. Anyway, these are simple things, but a lot of people don't do it. [00:14:03] S1: Why do you think most people get that wrong?
00:14:03 · Ty Morse, Brian Armstrong
[00:14:03] S1: Why do you think most people get that wrong? [00:14:05] S0: I think it's just lack of experience, but it's also... It takes another layer of processing in your mind. I don't know. You have to actually simulate the other person's brain in your brain to some degree. I mean, it's not like running a full simulation, but it's like a lightweight simulation, and you have to predict and interpret. So, I mean, it's partly probably an IQ thing, but I don't I don't... That sounds like mean. Don't like... Sound like... I actually think lots of people could do it if they were just practiced it a little bit more. Like, you have to not give into your first instinct, which is just to blurt out the thing you really are upset about. [00:14:39] S1: Going back to kind of the moment that you were founding Coinbase, there's this interesting video online of you and Paul Graham practicing the pitch at Y Combinator, and I think it was like 2012. What was it like doing that with him back in those days?
00:14:39 · Ty Morse, Brian Armstrong
[00:14:39] S1: Going back to kind of the moment that you were founding Coinbase, there's this interesting video online of you and Paul Graham practicing the pitch at Y Combinator, and I think it was like 2012. What was it like doing that with him back in those days? [00:14:54] S0: Yeah. Well, Paul Graham's a legend. You know, I had read almost all of his writing on his public website, which is still there, and I really admired him. He... I... He was like he's like a hero of mine. Right? I... And I... My dream was to kinda get accepted into Y Combinator. I applied several times. Like, finally, I got accepted with the the idea for Coinbase. And it was great to have access to someone like that and the other partners who were there. Like Sam Altman was running it at the time, and Gary Tan was there, and he was one of the partners. And Paul McCoy, Jessica Livingston. And and many of these folks are now doing amazing things in the world, and Gary's running YC now. So I really felt like I had gone to Mecca. You know? Like, we were living in a golden age of innovation and software. Like, this was my moment to shoot my shot, and I was sitting around, like, these people that were that were my heroes. Right? And it's actually kind of intimidating, like, when you're... You know, if you're really, like, excited about somebody and then you... Finally, you're in the room and you're like, you don't wanna say something stupid or whatever. Right? [00:15:51] S1: Especially the first time that you're doing that. [00:15:52] S0: Yeah. It gets
00:15:52 · Brian Armstrong, Ty Morse
[00:15:52] S0: Yeah. It gets [00:15:53] S1: a little easier after the, like, tenth person that you've, you know, only ever seen online. [00:15:57] S0: Exactly. And there's actually something very valuable about getting in the room with these people by any way, shape, or form you can because you start to realize, like, they're not, like, on some pedestal. Like, they are human, and they're incredibly impressive, and you can learn from them, but they're not, like... Fundamentally, they're made of the same stuff as you. And you can take the best parts from them, and they can be a mentor, and then you can also do your own thing. So anyway, in that moment, I was really just trying to, like, if Paul Graham tells me something, I'm gonna try to do it. You know? I'm gonna try to internalize it. I didn't have enough ego or too much ego to say, like, I know better than this. I'm like, this guy has literally helped, like, thousands of companies get off the ground. If he tells me something, I'm just gonna default do it and not try to be super innovative. I'm first just gonna learn from the masters, the best the best practices. [00:16:41] S1: I think the best people in history learn from the greats and, like, copy as much as they possibly can before start, like, innovating on their own. [00:16:47] S0: Yeah. It's dangerous as a beginner to be like, know, I'm gonna do my own thing. It's like... I think that is dangerous.
00:16:47 · Brian Armstrong, Ty Morse
[00:16:47] S0: Yeah. It's dangerous as a beginner to be like, know, I'm gonna do my own thing. It's like... I think that is dangerous. [00:16:52] S1: It's like going into a kitchen and just starting, you know, fucking with shit. Yeah. Fred Wilson was talking about this in in the Coinbase documentary right before you guys went public. And he said there's... He's never seen another cofounder, like, give their other cofounder more equity in hindsight, in, like, retrospect. What did you see in Fred Ehrsam when you were first meeting him, getting to know him, building that relationship? And then what made you do that decision?