00:42:48 · Ty Morse, Baiju Bhatt
[00:42:48] S0: And Nothing else. [00:42:49] S1: That was kind of the main thing. Right? We put a lot of the other functionality behind the sort of like hamburger button that, you know, the old design language of the hamburger button that leads to the basement. So that's where like the the the majority of the functionality was. But we kind of realized that if people were going to use this, they were going to use it as a stock market button, very different than where we started. And the first thing didn't work. So that was like a good mental model of like, if you... If you're doing something for the... This is what I say to myself, like, Baiju, if you're doing something for the first time, don't be too precious with the idea. Just, like, see the idea through to completion. And by doing so, you're so much more likely to figure out what the actual thing that has a really, really important impact is that you would have never gotten to if you didn't just like knucklehead your way through the first thing. [00:43:45] S0: I kind of like this. So you're basically saying as soon as you have an idea, you're just automatically saying, this is probably wrong, but I'm going to run with it. And I'm gonna go down like... I... The the way that I think about... I think I've kinda [00:43:56] S1: explained this. This is like this is not wrong. Yeah.
00:43:56 · Baiju Bhatt, Ty Morse
[00:43:56] S1: explained this. This is like this is not wrong. Yeah. [00:43:58] S0: Yeah. The way that I've... The way that I think about it is I try to walk like three steps down the path and then see how I'm feeling. If I like the thing, that's great. If I don't, I just turn around, come back, walk another three steps in another direction, and keep on doing that until you basically find the right thing. It's honestly a little bit like a maze, kind of. Yep. Where you're basically running down one side, you're like, shit. Hit it at end. Walk back to where I came. Run down the next path. [00:44:22] S1: Yeah. Yeah. It's it's actually pretty pretty spot on. Like, you have this, like, big, thorny problem that you have to unravel and, like, make sense of. How are you gonna do that? Are you gonna do it by, like, just thinking about it and, like, looking at it and being like, well, that's [00:44:37] S0: It'd be like it'd be like you're at the start of a maze, you're just trying to think through all the different paths, but you haven't actually had any contact with the enemy. Like, you haven't seen which are... Which places are the dead end. [00:44:46] S1: Start getting the new place.
00:44:46 · Baiju Bhatt, Ty Morse
[00:44:46] S1: Start getting the new place. [00:44:47] S0: Yeah. What paths are the most, like, distinct? So that's the that's the first one. You basically come in with this idea of we're gonna build the everything app for finance, kind of. You know, you're gonna get your finance news, you're gonna get your stocks, you're gonna get your information here, you're gonna be able to trade. And then you basically dial it back. And I like the whole simplicity. You figure out, like, what is the specific thing that my customers are gonna click on my app for? And we're just gonna do that really well. And then we'll hide everything that isn't that thing behind, you know, basically a bunch of buttons that you have to click, and it's not... It's kind of invisible at that point. [00:45:18] S1: It's it's all there. It's like it's it's it's not so much hiding as much as it is focusing. Right? Like, is what is the 80% use case? If that's the 80% use case, your form and function, right? The form should match that function, right? Now, if you take the 20% of use cases and you treat them like they're 80% use cases, you're not mapping to the way people actually will want to interact with it most of the time. Yeah. You still want the stuff there, and you still want it easily accessible. You wanna think through all that stuff, but, like, people are gonna have very specific usage patterns or in our case, like, they look at it and they put it down. Right?
00:45:18 · Baiju Bhatt, Ty Morse
[00:45:18] S1: It's it's all there. It's like it's it's it's not so much hiding as much as it is focusing. Right? Like, is what is the 80% use case? If that's the 80% use case, your form and function, right? The form should match that function, right? Now, if you take the 20% of use cases and you treat them like they're 80% use cases, you're not mapping to the way people actually will want to interact with it most of the time. Yeah. You still want the stuff there, and you still want it easily accessible. You wanna think through all that stuff, but, like, people are gonna have very specific usage patterns or in our case, like, they look at it and they put it down. Right? [00:45:58] S0: What have been the other big moments where you just decided to take action, try things out, take shots on goal, go down that maze, and then realized it was just dead end and you needed to walk back? [00:46:09] S1: I mean, this feels a lot like that right now. I don't know that we're walking down a dead end to the maze, but like [00:46:14] S0: You're walking down some path and it's unclear. [00:46:16] S1: Yeah. Like, how are we gonna build an an energy grid in orbit? Well, it's like, well, the first idea... And I think this is kind of relevant. It's like the first idea is like, well, we're going to pattern match the way that things in space have done before through this, like, DOD and then a commercialization approach. And, like, is this necessarily the be all end all of what we're going to be doing in ten years? We'll have to figure it out.
00:46:16 · Baiju Bhatt, Ty Morse
[00:46:16] S1: Yeah. Like, how are we gonna build an an energy grid in orbit? Well, it's like, well, the first idea... And I think this is kind of relevant. It's like the first idea is like, well, we're going to pattern match the way that things in space have done before through this, like, DOD and then a commercialization approach. And, like, is this necessarily the be all end all of what we're going to be doing in ten years? We'll have to figure it out. [00:46:44] S0: Right? The great thing is, and I... I've I've thought about this a lot recently too, is you want to basically build a culture. So with with an app, it's super easy. You build a culture of shipping and basically trying things by just testing stuff. You make a thing, you test it, you get feedback, you run that iterative loop. For this sort of thing, it's it's a lot more difficult because your iteration loops are way longer and way less clear. Like, if your if your thing is a contract with the government, that might take multiple years just to have the first thing that you can even tell them about. [00:47:15] S1: And then [00:47:16] S0: by the time you've told them, okay, then it might be, like, two or three more years before you actually have something that's there. That's six years. Yeah. So how do you think about basically That? When you're going down this path, when you're going down through this maze, how do you kind of do that with this sort of stuff?
00:47:16 · Ty Morse, Baiju Bhatt
[00:47:16] S0: by the time you've told them, okay, then it might be, like, two or three more years before you actually have something that's there. That's six years. Yeah. So how do you think about basically That? When you're going down this path, when you're going down through this maze, how do you kind of do that with this sort of stuff? [00:47:31] S1: I think it's actually interesting to look at this power beaming, like the hardware that's behind you right over there from this perspective. So space based solar power, collecting power in space, beaming it down for Earth for use. Right? This is like a seventies idea. This is not new at all. This is one of [00:47:50] S0: those things where they just, like, assume that this was the future. [00:47:53] S1: Yeah. People kind of assumed this was the future, and then nobody actually did it. And if you look at the history of why, and I took, like, real intellectual issue with this. Right? Where if you look at, why it's that original idea for space solar power, just like the way the idea was constructed, it didn't work unless you had a really big satellite, like the size of a kilometer or multiple kilometers. [00:48:19] S0: And why was that?