01:23:58 · John Coogan, Doug O'Laughlin
[01:23:58] S1: Yep. [01:23:58] S6: And we are like, okay. We can't go backwards. We definitely... Maybe we're not, like, like, going crazy with opus fast mode or something like that. Yeah. But I think that we will continue to be spending quite a bit, and I think what we're doing is a little different than the average company. We're a little younger. Right? There are companies out there where the average employee age is north of 50. Do you think they really care to figure out cloud code? No, dude. They're just trying to collect some checks before retirement. Like, I think that, you know, it just... It takes a long time for people to adopt new technology. This is something that's like the the technology industry has been very aware of for a long time. There's like an s curve in it... Of adoption, and I think we are still pretty early. So it's gonna take some time. My favorite my favorite theme is always to pay attention during the holidays, actually. You watch that their step functions of adoption happen during the holidays because young people go home to their... You know, to the boomer family and explain, hey. Have you seen muse try to buy you an advent calendar or something at Thanksgiving? And they're like, wow. This is magic. So there's there's some really cool things there that that's often why we see step function. A good example is Cloud Code's true inflection moment, even though they had, like, 4.5 out for a while [01:25:05] S1: Yeah.
01:25:05 · John Coogan, Doug O'Laughlin
[01:25:05] S1: Yeah. [01:25:05] S6: Was during Christmas because everyone had time off, and they're like, hey. I wanna vibe code a project. And then everyone's like... They came back to work, and they're like, guys, you gotta try this. [01:25:13] S1: So Yeah. So that's very interesting because in the s one, they they noted that revenue or or or token spend might go down by 20% in that two week Christmas holiday, but that's actually where your hardcore users are taking a break but your new users are actually coming in and you're sort of creating a new cohort that will scale and be the influencer of the next year, which is which is very interesting dynamic. [01:25:39] S6: That's Totally possible. Right? They're taking a break. But I think... I I I just think it's really interesting that these these adoption curves are, like... They're not continuous. And the most important thing is looking for the next adoption curve to see what the next what the next s curve is. Right? Like, it's very clear. Cloud Code is gonna be... Or, like, rather, let's say the the white collar work replacement is the biggest one possible. Yep. And it's, you know, relatively early on, but it's still really large wave. What's the next one gonna be? It's gonna be really hard. We... Biology could be, but I don't think it's gonna be anytime soon. Yeah. Cybersecurity probably is now moving up the list. Agented consumer stuff, definitely I think moving up the list with Muse. I've been...
01:26:21 · Jordi Hays
[01:26:21] S0: How are you? What's the overall semi analysis company view on the, like, market side, like, personal agent market sizing? Because people have tried to do... Like, I think some people... Like, reading into the the meta earnings call, I think people... I was at least a little bit surprised to see that, like, shopping was the number one use case just simply because shopping on the sites that Muse supports, like Shopify stores, is already so efficient. Like you just can't... It'd be hard to actually... Like if you tell your Muse agent to buy something at the same time that you have the product that you wanna buy, like it's not like there's real, like, time savings. Yeah. And people and this idea that, like, people like shopping. So how are you guys thinking of that market? When I see that Meta is doing a $95,000,000,000 equity financing, I'm assuming that they're still gunning for this sort of AGI SI vision and it's not really in service of the personal agent product that they have traction with right now. But what's the broader outlook? Joe, you want to take this? Or...
01:27:32 · Joey Brookhart, John Coogan
[01:27:32] S8: Yeah. I mean, think... Look. They're they're still very determined in enterprise AI in achieving AGI there. And, you know, I think in '27, we'll see them monetize new enterprise pretty quickly. You know, they always in consumer when it's a new ad format, you know, we see delayed monetization. Obviously ecom, just any of like their ad markets today, serve ecom travel, know, will be big areas in consumer as well and we know consumers don't like to pay for stuff. Yep. So taking a cut or advertising some performance based outcome is the way it will be monetized. And I think we can get to the point where they talked about on the call where your consumer agents are talking to business agents and they facilitate that transaction and, you know, take 5%. [01:28:15] S1: Yeah. Yeah. It seems like Zach or Meta internally is still just like a little bit cagey about being like, we're going to make a ton of money off of ads. And so they'll they'll frame it differently in the press releases, but the the big dollars come from advertising when you're in the meta organization. Doug, you mentioned your Muse Maxi, your Clog Code Maxi. Do you have any linkages between your two agents? I'm interested in your philosophy around, like, will you have a super agent that talks to everything at some point? Or are you happy to have two tools, two tabs, two apps?
01:28:49 · Doug O'Laughlin, John Coogan
[01:28:49] S6: I I think I'm happy to have two two tools and two tabs mostly because I think of Muse as intensely my personal. Sure. Like, I don't let it touch my work email. And then I think of Cloud Code is... Like, has a lot of the in... Inner linkages with my work email. Sure. I don't think it says proactive. Like, I am kind of excited. Like, let's just say, like, for better or for worse, Anthropic really has positioned itself as the enterprise solution. Yep. And if they have a really solid enterprise clawed, you know, clawed muse or whatever, I'm probably gonna use it just because I do kind of trust their safety to a certain extent. Like, they sure be talking about it in their s one. So I think Yeah. I think I think that that's how I've mentally bucketed it versus, like, you know, Meta has all my data anyway. So Sure. And, like, you know, I'm scrolling on... I'm doom scrolling on Meta Yeah. On on on Reels. What's what's the difference between doom scrolling on Muse versus Reels? Yeah. It's like It's [01:29:42] S1: of essentially buying It's like it's like you have an executive assistant at work and then your Claude instance will be like a executive assistant extension and then you have a personal assistant at home if you're doing very very well And your muse agent can be your sort of personal assistant. And these two might interface, but they're separate. [01:30:02] S6: Well, it's different. Might interface. Like, actually, usually what it is, it's forwarding emails one to the other.
01:30:02 · Doug O'Laughlin, John Coogan, Jordi Hays
[01:30:02] S6: Well, it's different. Might interface. Like, actually, usually what it is, it's forwarding emails one to the other. [01:30:06] S1: Sure. Sure. Yeah. But but actually having that clean line is great and that's the way a lot of extremely high net worth individuals set up their lives. They have someone who works at the the company, and then they have someone that works at their family office, and they too can communicate, but they are in separate organizations. So maybe that's [01:30:21] S6: a I think it's good from a a separation perspective, but, like, I I don't know. I also just think that, like, you know, the personal assistant stuff, it is really sick to just, like... I know the the lamest one, everyone's like, oh, just reads your emails, but, like, dude, I got a lot of emails, man. I think a lot of people, it's like, okay. For example, you have a kid's birthday party, and you're, like, organizing the kid's birthday party and like you just like, oh, your your wife sends you some reel and there's like, hey, I wanna go to school. You're like, you're... [01:30:47] S0: Kid's teacher says describe your child in three whole... [01:30:50] S1: That was a bad example.... [01:30:51] S0: Stumped, you know. That was a bad example.