00:11:43 · Micky Malka, David Senra
[00:11:43] S1: about That's what's special. Yeah. And that's why the writing is special for us. Okay. We have to adhere to that. [00:11:48] S0: So do you wanna talk about the one that you you wrote recently on tokens? Yeah. So I love love what you just said. Like, I can... You read it, it's very long and there's charts and everything else, but you're like, I can distill it down to a napkin. I think compression is understanding. Let's start with like the the napkin version of the token essay, and then you can expand on it from there.
00:12:10 · Micky Malka
[00:12:10] S1: The concept is very simple. The word token means something different to everybody. If we start with Ryan from Visa, the world he defines token is different than the world that Sundar has for token at Google, or the different word that OpenAI has for token or on topic. They're all different, but they all mean the same. It's machine readable information. So if you think about the companies, we call them token factories because just think about the industrial revolution example in this token revolution era, where every company needs a supply of tokens of information, money and knowledge, and then they do something and they deliver something new. And you need basically three components to deliver any service, any promise, or any product. You're gonna need to understand identity, you're gonna need to understand value, and you need to understand the intelligence that goes into it. And right now, we're in the early innings. What we're starting to see first is the Frontier Labs being the token factories. They're taking all information from the web, from videos, from the world, and they're finding a way to ingest it and create a different set of tokens that somebody else can consume. So they are the raw materials providers to these factories. Now, in the next few years, we're gonna see that evolution go deeper and deeper and deeper. And it will be much more personalized, and it will be much more complete to verticals that we haven't even touched. Like today, token factories don't touch money that much. Money's been outside of AI, and we're on year four or five. It's funny because money is supposed to be one of the first most fungible things that should be playing the game, and it's not.
00:13:45 · David Senra, Micky Malka
[00:13:45] S0: Why do you think it should be one of the the first things to playing the game? [00:13:48] S1: Because it it's it's one of the things that flows the most in the world. Everything flows through money. Like, my my whole life, the thing about what keeps my learning going is I follow flows. I believe that nothing's static. Money never static. Money is like gravity. It always falls. It always moves. It's always going somewhere. It's like water. It's never stuck. Energy is flowing everywhere. From the lights that we're in here, but also our own energies. Right now we're creating both energies and we're sharing that energy. And so I find that for something that is as as dynamic as money, it is not attached to AI yet on anything. [00:14:35] S0: So how does it get attached? [00:14:37] S1: I think it's gonna be that intersection between probably what blockchains will do and AI will do, because you will need to have intelligent smart contracts that will do stuff on your behalf. And you can start to see great entrepreneurs and great founders working on it. You can... We can talk about Patrick at Stripe and and how they're building all this. [00:14:55] S0: Literally, when you were saying that, I just heard John Collison talk about this. And basically, he said that that's the only thing he's working on. It's like a gen... Payments for agents.
00:14:55 · David Senra, Micky Malka
[00:14:55] S0: Literally, when you were saying that, I just heard John Collison talk about this. And basically, he said that that's the only thing he's working on. It's like a gen... Payments for agents. [00:15:03] S1: Yeah. And and that's the future. Or you can talk to anybody in that space or Vlad Aromino doing the same for for equities. And you can see how they're tokenizing assets. And we're in this early innings, but we're behind compared to knowledge. Knowledge went much faster. Money is is behind, which is fine. [00:15:20] S0: So explain, because I don't know anything about this. And you you study this night and day. So explain what you think is gonna happen with this in like the next like year or two. [00:15:28] S1: I don't know the next year or two. It's hard to know because with the speed of AI, what happens in the next twelve months. [00:15:34] S0: Or, yeah, next few months, whatever.
00:15:34 · David Senra, Micky Malka
[00:15:34] S0: Or, yeah, next few months, whatever. [00:15:35] S1: But what what I will say is that what we should start seeing very soon is agents that are designed for specific functions that will take care of your financial life in ways that you have never been taken care of. And some of the best founders have articulated this really well. David from New Bank, David Bellet said, you know, mobile was the way to put a bank in your pocket. Now AI is gonna be the way to get you the banker in your pocket. So what I expect to see very, very soon is an AI agent that can go and do all kinds of investment decisions, recommendations. He can go do all kinds of commerce decisions and recommendations, and he can start to do any kind of payment decisions and recommendations on your behalf. And you are gonna start to see how that's gonna free time and ideas that you don't have today. We're just starting. The signals that this is going the right way signals prediction markets. Prediction markets, it's an interesting market. Some people call it gambling, some people call it a place where you can bet on anything twenty four seven. But here's the thing, it's twenty four seven. And what agents need are twenty four seven rails. So, all of this is building the rails to allow all of this to happen. And what we expect is that we're gonna see a bunch of new companies or incumbents that are gonna be shipping these features in ways that we have not experienced before.
00:17:04 · David Senra
[00:17:04] S0: That was gonna be my next question to you. Who do think wins this? Because you just named three pretty big well established companies, Stripe, Robinhood, New Bank. You think it comes from them or you think it comes from a startup?