Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth
01:14:15 · Brian Balfour
[01:14:15] S1: Well, actually, just a couple more points on this topic. Oh, We should we should go. Is like, is... There's probably two more things I would say about this. One is that, so if you're a CEO listening to this, I would say that most CEOs or most executives are incredibly disconnected from the actual AI adoption taking place in in in... Inside their companies. I think a lot a lot of executives who have done these decrees and all that kind of stuff think it's kind of happening naturally. But we talk to both groups. We talk to tons of end users, and we talk to tons of executives. The story we hear from the end users, the PMs, the hinge, all that kind of stuff that we talk to kind of using all this stuff, one of the main questions we ask them is, you know, if somebody... If we're talking to somebody who's picked up a prototyping tool, say, well, how many other people on the product and design team are using this? Almost 90% of the time, it's like, ah, it's like me and this one other person, and everybody else hasn't, like, taken it up. Right? And so there's a huge disconnect. And we heard one story, and I won't... I can't say the name, but the... It's a company we all know. It's a major tech company, tech forward company. CEO's been out there talking about being AI native. We talked to one of their, like, print... You know, principal PMs. Person was early to the prototyping tools. This person shared a prototype with the designer, the Inge Manager. The designer and Inge Manager escalated it to the VPs. It caused this whole conversation. Month later, kind of the... It was like kind of still stalling out. This PM happened to then, you know, attend a happy hour where the the CEO was at and, approached the CEO and told the the CEO about the experiment that, they were running with prototyping and stuff. And the CEO was like, this is fantastic. Like, why... You know, like like, where is it at right now? I was like, oh, well, x... You know, x y z happened. And the CEO had no idea. And then the CEO was like, okay, let me take care of it. And then the next day, it happened. So there... One is that you have to go to the ground floor on this stuff. Some of the best companies like Shopify and others are measuring actual adoption and usage. They've gone to the extreme, like, kind of on that on that front to to get a bunch of signals in close to the ground.
01:16:31 · Brian Balfour
But it's just that it just goes to show that, this is... You know, I don't think we wanna talk about quote unquote founder mode, but, the reality is it's it's not just about getting into the weeds of your product, but with something this sizable, you gotta get into the weeds of the transformation to, like, really understand what's going on and adopt it. So that... That's point number one. The second point I would say is, for Reforge, on, we do this podcast, called unsolicited feedback. Know, had this great quote on it. He was like, look. The slowest... Your output is, constrained by the slowest part of your system. And, and I thought that was... That stuck in my head because it's absolutely true. And so if you think about AI adoption as a system, there's all parts of the system that could be slowing adoption. It might be that people don't feel permission, or they don't have the budget, or they don't have the knowledge, or destruct... All these types of things. Right? But in a lot of these cases, it's things like IT, legal, procurement, are the slowest part of the friction and are kind of setting the pace of all of this output. And you can also see this in, in just product teams, which is, you know, a lot of... There's been all this talk about, you know, product managers are becoming the new bottleneck because engineers are speeding up. Well, that's because people are speeding up one part of the product system and not the other parts. Which makes sense. Like, they adopted all of this tooling for engineers because they're the biggest headcount and the most expensive and, like, all that type of stuff. But product is an output of design PMs and engineering. The system is there not to produce code. It's to ship product. Right? And and shipping product is the function of those three things. So if you just accelerate one part of the system, you're just going to move to the bottleneck to another part. And your actual product output, the output of the system doesn't accelerate either. So I think you really got to... People have to really understand those two things. It's like, what is actually happening on the ground floor and what what is the slowest part? What is the thing that is causing, you know, the slowest part of the adoption? Just like attack attack them ruthlessly if if you're really serious about making this transition.
01:18:46 · Lenny Rachitsky, Brian Balfour
[01:18:46] S0: What a wild time we're living through. [01:18:48] S1: It is a wild time. [01:18:49] S0: It's just like what? We had all these ways that we all [01:18:52] S1: say used to. Okay. [01:18:53] S0: This is how we do it. [01:18:54] S1: Yeah. Yeah. It's it's exciting and exhausting at the same time, man. That's how that's how I think about it. [01:18:58] S0: That's such a simple way of describing the road. Yeah. Oh my god. Okay. Brian, is there anything else before we get to a very [01:19:07] S1: exciting That's it. Let's do lightning round. [01:19:09] S0: Let's do [01:19:09] S1: a zap zap. [01:19:10] S0: Yeah. Ding ding ding. Alright. Brian, I've got five questions for you. Are you ready? [01:19:14] S1: Let's do it. Let's do it. [01:19:15] S0: Okay. What are two or three books that you find yourself recommending most to other people?
01:19:15 · Lenny Rachitsky, Brian Balfour
[01:19:15] S0: Okay. What are two or three books that you find yourself recommending most to other people? [01:19:20] S1: My my god honest answer is that I have not had the time to finish an entire book since I had my second child. Mhmm. So from a complete book standpoint, I have not I have not been able to, things that I've been... You know, that I actively read on a regular basis, just like other content out there, that I'll throw out there is, gosh, Jamin Ball from Altimeter Capital writes this great newsletter called Clouded Judgment, which is kind of mixture of market thoughts as well as, like, market stats, that, like... That's really useful to help me keep a pulse on the market. You know, I was just reading through some, like, stuff from NFX that was, that... That's been pretty good lately on all of this. I know James Currier and I share. We lived a lot of the same, cycles through social and stuff, so I tend to identify with that. So I don't know. Those are two things that, that I love reading. And, sorry, I'll give one more shout out to a different podcast, which is from, from two guys at Spark Capital, Nabil Hyatt, which I know from my early Boston days and Fraser. Sorry. I'm blanking on the last name right now who was... Head of product at OpenAI. They've got a great format where it's just those two riffing on some ideas and stuff. And, I, yeah, highly suggest that one. I I like that one a lot.
01:19:20 · Brian Balfour, Lenny Rachitsky
[01:19:20] S1: My my god honest answer is that I have not had the time to finish an entire book since I had my second child. Mhmm. So from a complete book standpoint, I have not I have not been able to, things that I've been... You know, that I actively read on a regular basis, just like other content out there, that I'll throw out there is, gosh, Jamin Ball from Altimeter Capital writes this great newsletter called Clouded Judgment, which is kind of mixture of market thoughts as well as, like, market stats, that, like... That's really useful to help me keep a pulse on the market. You know, I was just reading through some, like, stuff from NFX that was, that... That's been pretty good lately on all of this. I know James Currier and I share. We lived a lot of the same, cycles through social and stuff, so I tend to identify with that. So I don't know. Those are two things that, that I love reading. And, sorry, I'll give one more shout out to a different podcast, which is from, from two guys at Spark Capital, Nabil Hyatt, which I know from my early Boston days and Fraser. Sorry. I'm blanking on the last name right now who was... Head of product at OpenAI. They've got a great format where it's just those two riffing on some ideas and stuff. And, I, yeah, highly suggest that one. I I like that one a lot. [01:20:45] S0: Here's my reading tip that has changed my reading habits. Brian Johnson, the longevity guy, he has this advice for better sleep, which includes before you go to sleep, read for ten minutes
01:20:45 · Lenny Rachitsky, Brian Balfour
[01:20:45] S0: Here's my reading tip that has changed my reading habits. Brian Johnson, the longevity guy, he has this advice for better sleep, which includes before you go to sleep, read for ten minutes [01:20:58] S1: in bed. Does put you to sleep. Part of like I retain anything that I read that close to bed, Do you feel like you retain it? [01:21:05] S0: I do. I do. I'm reading fiction. Like, it's nonfiction. You wanna... Sorry. Yeah. You wanna read something calm, not like I'm learning. So I'm reading I'm reading fiction, and it's really nice. And knowing that this is gonna help me sleep better makes me motivated. It's actually [01:21:18] S1: There's an incentive. There's a reward there. Yeah. They're about rewards and creating behavior change. [01:21:23] S0: Yeah. Exactly. And the the reason to do it is this whole thing is you wanna get to low resting heart rate, and then help slow your resting heart. [01:21:29] S1: So I've got some other sleep tips on that front if you wanna go down that path, but we'll save that [01:21:33] S0: for you. That'll be for the third podcast. Okay. Next question. Do have a favorite recent movie or TV show that you really see... Recently enjoyed?