Invest Like the Best with Patrick O'Shaughnessy
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Daniel Schwartz
[00:00:00] S0: Can you talk about the very top of that talent funnel and the things that you have done and still do that are the most effective at finding people when they're very young? I'm interested down to the granular level of what questions are you asking them when you first meet them? What is that very top of funnel for the early mid-20-something talent? [00:00:00] S2: I'm a step before you. The question is, how do you meet them? And it's, generally speaking, word of mouth and being willing to open as many doors as you can. Someone made an offhand comment to me when I was in Hong Kong passing through an investment firm about this superstar analyst who had just left. His name is Josh Kobza. Took note and then cold-called Josh. And Josh was like, "How did you get my number?" "Don't worry about it, Josh, it's fine." Anyway, brought him to Miami. We hired him on the spot. And I would, and I've said this in the past, we'd go to Wharton and HBS and get the resume book. Cold email people who had impressive resumes. And if they seemed like they were really passionate, and they were looking for a project and not just a job, I'd offer people jobs on the spot. Which again, was unheard of. And I'm sure you have some examples in your world.
· Daniel Schwartz, Alex Behring
[00:00:00] S2: I'm a step before you. The question is, how do you meet them? And it's, generally speaking, word of mouth and being willing to open as many doors as you can. Someone made an offhand comment to me when I was in Hong Kong passing through an investment firm about this superstar analyst who had just left. His name is Josh Kobza. Took note and then cold-called Josh. And Josh was like, "How did you get my number?" "Don't worry about it, Josh, it's fine." Anyway, brought him to Miami. We hired him on the spot. And I would, and I've said this in the past, we'd go to Wharton and HBS and get the resume book. Cold email people who had impressive resumes. And if they seemed like they were really passionate, and they were looking for a project and not just a job, I'd offer people jobs on the spot. Which again, was unheard of. And I'm sure you have some examples in your world. [00:00:00] S1: The two comments I would make are when you look at those resumes and when you talk to people, you're trying to identify the people that achieved a lot for their age on the young cohort, because that's indicative of them being hardworking and ambitious in a positive way. I find that speaks volumes, in terms of them having a chance of really succeeding. Because, when I look here at the firm, at cohorts of analysts and young people that we recruited over a long time, and then I try to think, what is it that makes, in hindsight, some of the better ones – what made them stand out from the rest? I think they really, really, really, really, really wanted it.
· Alex Behring, Patrick O'Shaughnessy
[00:00:00] S1: The two comments I would make are when you look at those resumes and when you talk to people, you're trying to identify the people that achieved a lot for their age on the young cohort, because that's indicative of them being hardworking and ambitious in a positive way. I find that speaks volumes, in terms of them having a chance of really succeeding. Because, when I look here at the firm, at cohorts of analysts and young people that we recruited over a long time, and then I try to think, what is it that makes, in hindsight, some of the better ones – what made them stand out from the rest? I think they really, really, really, really, really wanted it. [00:00:00] S0: One of the comments I heard, I don't know why I was reminded of this. Maybe there's somewhat of a relation here, which is the concept that when you bought BK originally, that the brand was way bigger than the business. And I just thought that was like, an interesting framing. And I'm curious for you to say a little bit more about that insight or that concept. And whether or not that's become something that you keep your eye out for, where a brand is bigger than a business.
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Alex Behring, Daniel Schwartz
[00:00:00] S0: One of the comments I heard, I don't know why I was reminded of this. Maybe there's somewhat of a relation here, which is the concept that when you bought BK originally, that the brand was way bigger than the business. And I just thought that was like, an interesting framing. And I'm curious for you to say a little bit more about that insight or that concept. And whether or not that's become something that you keep your eye out for, where a brand is bigger than a business. [00:00:00] S1: Listen, I grew up in Brazil, as you know. I used to come to the U.S. since I was seven years old, and I was just crazy for Burger King and for Whoppers. Which, every time I mentioned that, people thought I was being untruthful about it just because our investment was so successful. And I found proof on this letter that I just gave you, that shows that I wrote this in 1975, meaning I was seven years old. You can see my handwriting. [00:00:00] S2: Some nice handwriting for a seven-year-old. [00:00:00] S0: Very nice handwriting.
· Patrick O'Shaughnessy, Alex Behring, Daniel Schwartz
[00:00:00] S0: Very nice handwriting. [00:00:00] S1: Writing to my dad, saying I ate in this place called Burger King and that I ate Whoppers every single day. And then I worked, growing up during college, as a tour guide for Brazilians that came to Disney World in the U.S. And people just loved Burger King. It was a well-known brand in Brazil. Everyone you talked to and their cousin knew what Burger King was. There were no Burger Kings in Brazil. And then eventually, by the time we bought the company, there were like, maybe a dozen. So, this is illustrative of the fact that Burger King, not only in the United States, but globally – brand was much bigger than the business, which was a unique opportunity. Because to grow a brand like that is very hard. A lot of time and dollars. In the case of Burger King, yes, we can grow the brand further, but it was about... [00:00:00] S0: Easier to grow burgers than brand. [00:00:00] S1: Easier to open stores of a brand that everybody already wants. [00:00:00] S2: When we found the company on one of our screening exercises and we ran some math, we concluded it would take a billion and change dollars of equity capital to buy Burger King. At the time, McDonald's was, I don't know, say, like an 80, $90 billion company. Yum was a $30 billion company. And Burger King just felt like there was this mismatch. Obviously, we did a lot of work to justify and support this thesis that the brand was bigger than the business. But even just the very first glance, we both said, it doesn't make sense. [00:00:00] S1: This sounds wrong.
· Alex Behring, Daniel Schwartz, Patrick O'Shaughnessy
[00:00:00] S1: This sounds wrong. [00:00:00] S2: This sounds wrong. Of course, Alex is like, "You sure the share count's right? Missed some shares or something?" It didn't look right, but he made sure we got the share count right. And it didn't meet the smell test. And we asked some people around us. And I said, in the past, I asked my then-fiance, who was like a doctor, and my mom who was a lawyer – who are objectively smart, but not in finance. "McDonald's is $90 billion. What do you think Burger King's worth?" [00:00:00] S1: No one said a billion. [00:00:00] S2: No one said a billion. They're like, "I don't know, 20 billion, 30 billion." And so it met that smell test. And we did a lot of work to support the view that we would be able to run the business much, much more profitably from an EBITDA standpoint, from a cash flow standpoint. And if we got a few things right, we can grow it much faster, too. [00:00:00] S0: What was wrong? So obviously something had to contribute to the fact that it only took a billion of equity capital to buy the thing. What was the issue? And then what were the early levers that you used once you owned?