Venture with Grace
00:00:00 · Jake Saper, Dan Mishin
[00:00:00] S0: Hello everyone. Good afternoon. We're gonna try something weird. Everyone stand up. Everyone please stand up. Stand up. Stand up. Stand up. Stand Stand Stand up. Up. Stand Alright. Everyone copy what I'm doing. Okay? Copy what I'm doing. So only half of you are capable of doing a one eighty. I don't know what that means about this... Oh, you can sit down. There was no like substantive purpose in that other than like blood sugar levels need to change to feel excited to be here, which I am, and hopefully you are as well. I am excited to chat today with Dan from Manifest, if I can survive. Did you think it was the jumping that did that? Did I fuck that up? Or was it all of your weight [00:00:59] S1: Too much jumping.
00:00:59 · Dan Mishin, Jake Saper
[00:00:59] S1: Too much jumping. [00:01:00] S0: That caused the collapse? Okay. So I want to introduce Dan. Dan is a leader, in what I believe will be the most important new business model of the AI era. And I call that business model AI Native Services or AINS for short, because it's faster to say. I believe that AI Native Services will be to the AI era, what SaaS was to the cloud era. And I have some credibility in saying that because I work at Emergence. Emergence was... Our founding investment was in Salesforce. We were in many ways a core part of the growth of the early days of cloud. I believe that we are now in an era where this AI native services business model will look a lot like the way SaaS looked back then, and I think ultimately will grow into be a larger market. What is amazing about Dan is he is an example of, an early breakout company using this model, specifically in immigration law. So if there's anyone out here that needs a visa, Dan will get you that visa faster, better, and cheaper than competitors. So Dan, tell us a bit about your founding journey. Why did you start this? You started in 2024 when starting an AI native service felt crazy because everyone was backing SaaS. What gave you the guts to do this?
00:01:00 · Jake Saper, Dan Mishin
[00:01:00] S0: That caused the collapse? Okay. So I want to introduce Dan. Dan is a leader, in what I believe will be the most important new business model of the AI era. And I call that business model AI Native Services or AINS for short, because it's faster to say. I believe that AI Native Services will be to the AI era, what SaaS was to the cloud era. And I have some credibility in saying that because I work at Emergence. Emergence was... Our founding investment was in Salesforce. We were in many ways a core part of the growth of the early days of cloud. I believe that we are now in an era where this AI native services business model will look a lot like the way SaaS looked back then, and I think ultimately will grow into be a larger market. What is amazing about Dan is he is an example of, an early breakout company using this model, specifically in immigration law. So if there's anyone out here that needs a visa, Dan will get you that visa faster, better, and cheaper than competitors. So Dan, tell us a bit about your founding journey. Why did you start this? You started in 2024 when starting an AI native service felt crazy because everyone was backing SaaS. What gave you the guts to do this? [00:02:31] S1: I love that as real disruptors, you already disrupted the flow. That's like definitely the way to go. We just disrupted the banner. Let's see where we end here. Well, truly an honor to be here sitting with you. Person who actually came term AI native services. Is it true that like your blog post was like the first time this was like publicly mentioned as a term?
00:02:31 · Dan Mishin, Jake Saper
[00:02:31] S1: I love that as real disruptors, you already disrupted the flow. That's like definitely the way to go. We just disrupted the banner. Let's see where we end here. Well, truly an honor to be here sitting with you. Person who actually came term AI native services. Is it true that like your blog post was like the first time this was like publicly mentioned as a term? [00:02:56] S0: Yeah. So for context, in 2024, I wrote a post called the death of Deloitte. And this post went viral, and then I received a cease and desist letter from Deloitte, which didn't love the concept. But I defined this idea of AI native services in that moment, and the reason I chose that term was very intentional. Before people talked about, like, services as software, I really hate that phrase. It sounds kinda cool, and then when you actually push on it, it means nothing. So AI native services is intended to describe what Dan is, which is a startup created de novo in the AI era to deliver a service faster, better, and cheaper than legacy players. This is different than the AI roll up thing that has received a lot of funding, and so I intentionally called it AI native services to distinguish it from all the roll ups. What Dan is building is really interesting because he started an immigration law firm from scratch, and he has hired some of the best immigration law practitioners and put them on top of an AI platform to deliver this service faster, better, cheaper than incumbents.
00:02:56 · Jake Saper, Dan Mishin
[00:02:56] S0: Yeah. So for context, in 2024, I wrote a post called the death of Deloitte. And this post went viral, and then I received a cease and desist letter from Deloitte, which didn't love the concept. But I defined this idea of AI native services in that moment, and the reason I chose that term was very intentional. Before people talked about, like, services as software, I really hate that phrase. It sounds kinda cool, and then when you actually push on it, it means nothing. So AI native services is intended to describe what Dan is, which is a startup created de novo in the AI era to deliver a service faster, better, and cheaper than legacy players. This is different than the AI roll up thing that has received a lot of funding, and so I intentionally called it AI native services to distinguish it from all the roll ups. What Dan is building is really interesting because he started an immigration law firm from scratch, and he has hired some of the best immigration law practitioners and put them on top of an AI platform to deliver this service faster, better, cheaper than incumbents. [00:04:06] S1: Yeah. For sure. By the way, our very first hire, the very first lawyer who joined us, Nicole, is right there. She just flew in. [00:04:14] S0: I think it's very... Like, it's very cool to be the first person to join an AI native service because I'm sure you came from some fancy firm, and like leaving to join this dude as charming and good looking as he is without any evidence. [00:04:26] S1: Not sure about that.
00:04:26 · Dan Mishin, Jake Saper
[00:04:26] S1: Not sure about that. [00:04:27] S0: It can be hard to get your first services per employee because it's not like a software startup where everyone knows what this is. You had to leave your big fancy thing and join this. Now it's obvious, but like you deserve a lot of credit, and I hope your equity is paid out. [00:04:47] S1: But okay. Let's take a quick step back and actually define what AI native services is versus purely selling software. Can you raise your hand if you know what AI native services business model actually means? We've got one in the back. Everyone So is like, what the hell are you guys talking about? That's that's that's my read of the room. [00:05:07] S0: It's like... It's... I mean, it it is as if we were in 2000 on a stage, and we're like, do you guys know what SaaS is? And people were like, what the fuck are you talking about? What does that even mean? Like sassy? Like what does that we are in this moment. The fact that none of you raised your hands, like think about this moment ten years from now. You're gonna be like, oh shit. That was you know one of the most dominant business models of the AI era, and these two jackasses were on stage talking about it. So like remember this moment.